Episode of My First Million with Sam Parr and Shaan Puri.
Transcript
Note: This transcript was auto-generated from YouTube captions. It may contain errors and lacks speaker identification. A full Gemini audio transcript will replace this.
Kind: captions Language: en the dominant way to advertise is not super high production value finely produced uh content it’s what we call selfie content right i feel like i can rule the world i know i could be what i want to i put my all in it like no days off on the road let’s travel never looking back all right let’s do it we’re here what’s going on what’s up man um okay you want to jump in a little bit of chit chat how you ought to do it i want to tell you a quick story so our friend um can we the the guy who emailed hotels and asked for discounts can we name him or not no okay um well he he’s our friend he emailed hotels for a european trip and he got some crazy good deals he got like a three thousand dollar room for like so i’m in new york i need a place to stay from september first is september 25th i made a list of 20 hotels and i emailed them and these hotels probably would cost me maybe 15 to 20 000 for that period so like a thousand dollars a night i’m getting some at like 350 bucks four hundred dollars a night it’s working that’s what’s the what’s the gist of the email i have something that’s unfair so i say hey my name is sam parr um i am in town for three months but i need a place to stay from september first september 21st i need a relatively big room because i record this podcast called my first million and we have about uh i say like a million listeners a month and we record it with video so i need it to look really nice i also write this daily email that goes out to two million people and so like i need a comfortable place to work for my home right uh my budget is 350 tonight can you help me and uh and that works so uh why aren’t they giving to you for free bro that’s big influence or [ ] you should be getting it for free i don’t know i i i’m happy to pay for i don’t want to be a total mooch i just want a discount it’s not mooching you’re you’re going to give them a shout right whoever you catch no i won’t i wouldn’t give them a shout out just because they get me a place to stay i would only give me do you shout people out because they get i mean i get given stuff all the time and when people give me stuff and they and then they ask for a shout out i i say you know f off yeah actually the other day um there’s a company that i’m using their product so i reached out to him i was like hey uh i can name it i can i think i can name i think this should be fine so so basically i use this thing called passport uh it’s like international shipping company so you’ll say you have a brand you want to ship products to france or uk or australia or whatever each country has its own little problems with shipping with customs with uh tax with uh you know finding the right carrier to get a low low shipping cost there all that so these guys take care of it so i’m like oh this is a great product great idea so i emailed um the ceo alex and i was like hey man like uh this is great we’re gonna use it but how do i invest also uh he’s like oh like you know we’re not really raising around right now and i was like please and he was like is it you know what like um i think you’ve already been pretty helpful because you made some intros i think you can do some more i think you can do more uh he’s like i don’t want to fuss with paperwork like honestly it’s just a big headache how about i just give you some free shares and i was like i was like ah perfect like that’s amazing because it’s like a legit company it’s not like oh here’s advisor shares in my no name no revenue no user company like this is a real company and it’s a very small amount but i was like he’s so smart because he you sent me an email he goes hey dude excited to have you on board just signed us to return it he goes here’s kind of my expectations like what would make this a win for me is a b and c and um they’re all like totally reasonable requests but he just made it clear what he wants and i was like dude you couldn’t have paid me to do these things but just by giving me something free i feel the need to reciprocate by like over delivering on this for you i would rather in retrospect i would rather just buy my shares and not have any obligations but uh cool i’m glad we did it this way this is gonna be more fun and ultimately smart move by you so that’s called the law or reciprocity so um there’s been a lot of studies on this and if you read the book influenced by robert ciaodini it’s a uh it’s basically been proven through a lot of different stuff studies so a great example is if we’re next door neighbors and i say hey uh uh sean here you know i i had i ordered pizza and they gave me two here’s an extra one if you’d like right uh okay so i did something for you i gave you something the next day i go hey mike i don’t have a car can i borrow your car for an hour you are actually incredibly likely to let me borrow the car even though those two favors are not at all equal right in order to make like this rule works regardless of if they’re equal or not it just if someone owes you one you want to pay them back in some capacity and you’ll do it in the first possible chance you have so it’s actually a great rule and when i used to buy stuff so when i would buy cars i would always come with two i wrote a blog post i would come with two cans of coke and i would have one like hey uh i you know they had a sale and they had a sale do you you want you thirsty was them a drink and uh i would get discounts like that through buying stuff dude that’s great that’s like the coke can hack is awesome uh yeah i actually now i’m so like aware of it that i have to fight my inner tendency to want free [ ] so like if somebody wants to send me something i’m like not only do i not want to give out my address anymore i’m just like i don’t want to feel like i need to reciprocate anything to you so like it’s it’s actually not worth it for me to take these things uh like this is different because i think this company is going to be really big and i really respect the the founder but uh but now i’m like somebody hands me that diet coke no no thank you sir uh right like i i it’s not like it’s not like i think they’re trying anything it’s just i don’t wanna have any uh on my inner balance sheet i don’t wanna have any debts i only want assets on that in my internal boundaries i completely agree i do the exact same thing if someone offered or if they offered me something and i do want it for example someone sent me something for my dog because his hips were hurting and i was like just you know i’m not going to give you a shout out if i if i think things like life-changing i’ll talk about it just casually but like in no way are you you’re just doing me you’re getting this is a gift not a a payment exactly um all right so let’s uh let’s jump into some ideas or some topics what do you want to talk about i want to talk to you about a couple things um i want you to teach me about something that did do you want to talk about this two things friends with benefits are you prepared to discuss that yeah yeah we could talk about it because this is your realm but this is it’s totally your world but it’s the first time i’ve seen something in this space that actually interests me um and i think exactly it’s like well okay so first explain what it is and then i’ll tell you but basically and i’ll tell you why i’m interested but basically it’s like uh uh the first time i’ve seen this technology used in a useful way that isn’t just gimmicky right yeah yeah okay i know what you mean and ironically this is the one that i think i’m interested but i’m like i don’t really get it and then i like move on so so it’s cool we’re on the other end of this okay so what is this friends with benefits is a it’s basically a community it’s a membership club that was created by this guy in la that um you know he was he was the co-founder of a company called brood and they they make little michaela that instagram influencer who’s just like a digital avatar it’s like looks like a kind of looks like a real girl but like clearly it’s kind of digital and so they’re using like disney pixar style technology to make influencers on instagram that’s the company so he creates friends with benefits he’s basically like all right this is like a digital soho house basically we’re gonna invite only cool people uh in and you basically buy the friends with benefit token in order to enter so you buy this token called fwb and uh so there’s a million fwb out there and you buy in in order to get access to the to the met to the club which is basically just a discord group right it’s not like there’s nothing there’s no physical place to go there’s no like perks or discounts or whatever it’s basically it’s literally like you get to go into our discord and talk to other members here and um and so they were selling this thing it was like 75 tokens or something to join at the beginning yeah which was like i don’t know exactly what it was but i think it was more like a hundred dollars when it started and now that thing is that’s like a four thousand dollar membership to join that same because the token has appreciated like crazy so the the token even just since we were going to talk about this last podcast and i was like hang on i’m going to talk to somebody um who knows about the stuff let’s do it in the next episode wow it’s up 46 since this last week’s and when we talked about this so that that means it’s 68 uh 685 uh yeah so the membership is roughly seven grand now and uh to join you know like equinox which is like you know a high-end gym in in la new york sf uh where you get to go to this like fancy gym where it has spa steam room members whatever equinox eco equinox is 2 400 i think three 2 400 maybe 3 000 so this is double that now um to get into the discord so obviously you can tell i’m a little bit skeptical uh just to put some more numbers around it just to give you a sense of how big this is so basically this is now a 90 million dollar market cap community i think the founders tokens are like i don’t know exactly how much he holds but roughly i think the guy has like 40 or 50 million dollars of his token uh now the fun the thing that’s that’s which is you know exciting but you can’t sell that’s the real problem you can technically go sell on the market but on uniswap you can go you can go sell this thing but you practically speaking if the founder started to sell because he’s like sweet i want to bank 10 million from this i think it would a crash the price and b send a negative signal or as they call in the crypto world like it’s a it’s a rug pull uh you pull the rug out from under the people who believed in you and bought into this thing and you basically screw them all over and so this is like when i bought your big clout and then you sold all your big clout and it’s like oh [ ] i’m holding this empty bag that sam cashed out of i bought his token i believed in him sorry i didn’t know you did that so that would be well i don’t even know if i i don’t know if i actually did buy it but uh but plenty of people did and you know right now on big cloud let’s say i have i think my token i have like fifty thousand dollars of my own token cool my current usage of bitcoin big cloud’s pretty low my my belief in like it becoming the next big thing is you know it started off like a long shot and now i’d say it’s a longer shot so i would love to go sell that but doing so would basically screw over the people who invested in my token so i’m not going to do it uh like i’m in it for the long haul so i think that’s the challenge with this model is on paper you get this big gain but in reality i don’t know how much they’re gonna how much value they can reap out of this so that’s a high level tell me tell me some things yeah so i’m gonna tell you why i think this is actually incredibly interesting friends with benefits itself it’s not that’s not interesting to me um basically if you look at it it’s just like really good looking dudes and and ladies who are like going like and hanging out like it’s like a hip uh young la new york type of thing i don’t really have too much faith in those types of businesses that are they’re more jokes to me than they are actual real businesses um would you say that’s accurate uh why is it a joke because i don’t know if this is run like a like when i when i see it i’m like oh you’re just gonna run this like a like an art project um not necessarily like are you a party promoter uh is this a nightclub so either it’s a fad right because the problem with cool exclusive things is when you try to grow them they become less cool and less exclusive because you’re more people in um who you know so it comes becomes less less tight-knit the other thing is are you doing this because you want to be a cool guy or are you doing this because it’s actually like a really solid business underneath i think that’s kind of the other thing you’re talking about which is like my point what are your sort of intentions with this thing do i take it seriously or no but and here’s the butt so the thing about communities communities are great companies um the problem with them though is that they’re challenging to scale the more people who join oftentimes the worst it gets that’s like that’s yeah that’s the law of communities but why are you saying that communities are great businesses i would say communities are not great businesses what communities do you think are great business well let’s define these are all generalizations let’s define how we mean great when i say great i don’t mean it’s really hard to be huge huge like north of 100 north of a billion dollars but like they could make someone 10 to 20 million in sales a year at a pretty good profit margin and you can use that profit to build more stuff so for example trends i didn’t realize it at the time but had i still owned it or the hustle we could have turned that into trends as a paid community we could have turned it into an investment vehicle to invest in cool startups things like that and so that’s why it would it would have been great for me to own even though it may not be huge in itself it would have led to opportunities and it could have been quite profitable you know i could have paid myself millions of dollars a year because of it so that’s my definition of great now what’s interesting about friends with benefits is they use this software called collab lan have you looked at collab lan yeah well actually they used to use a different platform they used to use uh roll i think uh so roll was their old platform then it got roll got hacked and so all the all the tokens that were built on all the social tokens that were built on roll crashed uh when that happened is i guess they switched over to collab land so collab lantern is cool because the thing about communities is the more people who join the uh sometimes the worse it gets and so why this is interesting to me is that people are incentivized to stay and make the community valuable because their value goes up even if they don’t necessarily want to sell it um well i actually do think that like one or two people could sell their their thing their their token and if they want to bail but they’re incentivized to make the community better and i think that’s a great model i really actually think this model is amazing so so i thought about this uh two two different ways so let’s first do let’s first do uh let’s break it into three parts there’s what is this and why is this interesting there’s how big could this be and then there’s what other [ ] could you do like this what do you think the future looks like so let’s do what is this and how big is it so so i would say we we kind of explained friends benefits it’s a social token it’s used to create a membership club the membership cost now seven thousand dollars it’s really appreciated like crazy you know if you’re friends with benefits if you hold that token like ben ben is a member so ben got in at like probably 100 or a couple hundred bucks membership he never uses it so he’s like god the discord is super noisy like i’d have to like really go spend time in there to like make friends and do all the stuff i’m too busy for all that so like i never i basically never go in there um but he’s like it’s cool because i hold this token it’s going up so i have this like seat in the club and uh i could sell that if i wanted to or i could use it if i wanted to so he’s like it’s kind of cool he bought it kind of like just to just play with the technology just to play with like this new experiment so these are called social tokens the idea is that you know any creator any set of creators could create one of these so you know the paul brothers i think have had like the maverick club i think the milk boys have their own club and these are just like you know traditional you pay us a monthly subscription and you get access to insider content so this is basically owning instead of renting so instead of renting your spot in the club through a monthly fee you own your spot in the club and there’s a limited number of spots and then that’s an asset that you could then flip later to somebody else if you want to get out of the club and you want somebody else to take your spot and i think that everyone’s a lot awesome and everyone’s in line everyone is aligned and it becomes instead of a expense it becomes an investment so i think that is a switch that gets flipped right instead of a nine nine dollars a month okay cool i paid 900 but i own this thing and if i was correct in betting that like let’s say we made one for my first million right if we if they were correct and betting that this like let’s say nine months ago they’re like oh i think this podcast is gonna get bigger well guess what it did and if there was only whatever a thousand spots in our in our private club in our private group where we’re sharing either insights deals making introductions between people that sort of thing it’s a cute community of people that could be pretty valuable right like there’s a pretty strong case why we should create one of these for the like kind of fans of the show that are like hardcore members right um and then they own it and then they say all right cool the more popular sean and sam get the more people are gonna want to get into this club in my thousand dollar seat i’m gonna get value from it today and then i might flip it for three grand or ten grand two years from now or a year from now that’s like the promise yeah and and i think that’s a great idea now let me put something in perspective so did you know that soho house went public recently i saw you put this here so i started doing some research on it pretty pretty fascinating go break it down yeah so soho house it doesn’t have to be a bad business but it is so soho house is basically a members only club it’s basically a country club but instead of a golf course you get access to like a library feeling building like a with a bar and a restaurant and maybe a pool maybe sometimes they have a gym and it’s basically in new york la probably paris london it’s in where all like rich cool young people live it costs about two thousand or three thousand dollars a joint depending on how old you are and they have a hundred thousand members and they recently went public at a three billion dollar market cap and the reason why their business isn’t great is they took on a lot of debt covid really hurt them and uh i think maybe it’s slightly mismanaged but it’s not a bad people putting some numbers around that i think they had like 900 million dollars of debt um from because they’re buying real estate in the most prime locations right there they have real estate or if the leases were owned i don’t know which one uh in like you know manhattan la uh not san francisco around london so they had 870 million i think of debt and then during covid they furloughed ninety percent of their workforce i think so uh they furloughed ninety percent of the workforce but they only churned ten percent of members because hey the members are kind of wealthy and whatever and b they like offered other perks like kind of like digital perks to try to come up with other ideas because you couldn’t go into the building and and do your soho house like you know you know mingling or whatever whatever people do at these places and so the reason why forensic benefit interests me is i don’t care about this i don’t care about that company like i said i don’t think that they’re gonna run it like a proper company but if you were going to i think i would do the soho house model where i try to have buildings that are really nice and you really want to come and it’s ran like a proper company i would 100 do it this way that takes a lot of risk you know like i got to make sure that these members this the membership stays valuable but it incentivizes me to make my make it great for my members and i could use some of that money to buy buildings and i think so i think that i would use this model for a soho style membership yeah so so what do you think about us doing it why why would you or why wouldn’t you do it um i think that it makes a ton of sense there’s really only one reason why you wouldn’t do it which is do you want to more work yeah that’s pretty much the only thing and it’s like the thing we were talking about the very beginning like reciprocity if somebody gives you a diet coke you feel like you kind of yeah all right cool i’ll kind of hook you up there’s a as soon as somebody becomes a member of your club you feel obligated to make a really [ ] awesome club you’re like i will not sleep until this club is until you feel like you’re you’re getting the edge on this deal by 10x unfortunately that’s the way my personality is wired and i think you’re the same and so it’s like oh good do i want to over deliver on something right now i don’t know i gotta i gotta think before i commit to that because yeah before that’s the only reason why you wouldn’t do it but if you wanted to run this like a company and you wanted to create a co-working space and you wanted to do it with this model i think that’s that’s a i wouldn’t say easy but it’s a very interesting path to build something quite big yeah and i don’t know if i agree with you that he has to have a physical space i don’t really think it’s that it’s more you have to have value so okay so soho house is valuable because it’s a place you can go it’s kind of like a third place um you can see you know you know that everybody who else who’s there is cool so i think for this like the idea of having a digital community a discord slack facebook group whatever where everybody’s cool like you’ve seen this with trends that’s pretty valuable people people dig that they think about that like with trends you produce research reports right so you’re going to get access to intel intelligence about the market that’s interesting to you cool that that works too there’s also other stuff like for example i think that being able to access deals and deal flow is like pretty important to people um or at least a certain set of people who have more more sort of money than good investments and good investment opportunities around them and then the last piece is you could also do this with you could sort of like auction off time in a way so like there’s a world where we basically would say all right we create a friends with benefit token with that token comes you’re going to get access to me and sam uh like right now that token gets you one hour with me and sam and so we create basically a thousand booked out bookable hours when we mint these tokens but you also know that our time is going to become more valuable and you want to use it when you when it’s really important to you and so that’s going to appreciate in value over time as our you know elon musk in 2000 his time was easier to book than it is today today it’s basically priceless you basically cannot pay any amount of money there might be some huge amount of money that you would have to pay to get an hour of his time uh with him not getting anything else in return and so um something that’s the other thing you could offer a value is basically time with people of value and that time could be like an investment you’re basically betting today that i want to i want to hold a block of sam’s kind of like advice or coaching or you know just hangout time because i think that’s going to go up in value over time yeah so anyway it interests me um and i agree i think we’re aligned there can i tell you about one more interesting thing that is related to rich people i yes so have you ever heard of this company called wealthx no what is it okay so every year wealthx is wealthx is a company it’s a database company and what they do is they basically use publicly available uh records so property records and and sometimes you can get people’s tax returns things like that and they look for people who are ultra high net worth ultra high net worth is defined as 30 million dollars in assets and they create this massive database i believe there’s 800 to 700 000 people in the world that are considered ultra high net worth and all they do is they comb through loads of different data and then they have independent researchers who work their hardest to verify that this is true and the reason why i discovered this is for years wealth x is famous every year they put together a study that says here’s how the wealthy are investing their assets and they create this end-of-year asset allocation and they say wealthy people have this much in gold this much in real estate whatever um and i think that this is an interesting business and it was actually recently acquired by a publicly traded company so i was able to look back at their at their numbers and i actually think that a company like this is shockingly easy to start and i think this company undersold so they sold for 20 million dollars in cash they were doing about 12 million in revenue with 800 000 in profit if i was the founder of this company i never would have sold they sell this to people for 15 000 or to other companies for 15 000 a year for subscription access and they basically are selling it to people who manage um people’s money so um right well financial advisors things like this but the interesting thing to me and the takeaway to this if you’re listening i think this model of business this data business we’ve called this um i think we said that that messy data wants to be free is that or sorry data wants to be free data wants to be free yeah data wants to be free and and and and and um doesn’t mean free price wise it wants to be it’s like trapped and it wants to be let free basically correct and the founder of cb insights that does kind of like this for publicly or for privately held companies he told me the same thing he goes our whole motto model motto is uh there’s a bunch of dirty muddy data out there and we’re going to go and find it and just make it really easy to consume that’s what wealthex did i’m just pretty certain i’ve read the glasstop reviews i’m pretty certain that this business is amazingly easy to copy and to figure out so the ways that they get data is they’ll they’ll tell you they’ll look at who owns a jet they’ll figure out who’s donating money so if you donate money to a non-profit oftentimes that’s made public if you’re buying personal property if you have certain hobbies if you donate get on the list they don’t know how much you have but they’re like oh sam park big donation must have money all right put them on the list yeah they look at per um they look at what so if you’re part of tiger glo uh what’s it called tiger 21 if you um if you have certain interests certain hobbies donate money that’s how they get their information it’s just not that hard to build this type of business now right it is hard to sell but everything’s hard to sell if you’re going to get in the phones and you got to call people you you sell some 15 grand that’s always hard but by creating the data out of your blogs i think this is such a straightforward business if you wanted to make some money um so so so they didn’t make a ton of money and why is that so this seems like like cb insights is a big business i don’t know i don’t know what cba says what was it worth 200 million uh worth that or making that revenue revenue yeah exactly it’s worth probably closer to a billion dollars then yeah really more by the way founder listens to the pod shout out to anand i think you think he’s uh he’s a pretty avid listener so that that business worked in a much bigger way but same principle like you’re saying right data is there it’s muddy we go dig it up we wash it off we rinse it we polish it we package it we say here you go here’s that data you’ve been looking for it was here like yeah you could have gone and got it yourself but man you don’t want to go scrub through that mud well let us do that for you let us organize this whole thing so you just type in the name you want to know about type in the industry you want to know about and bam here’s the info and so um that business worked why is it is it because financial advisors there weren’t enough of them no there’s a lot of them they weren’t willing to pay for this info why do you think this business didn’t work and what would you do differently it probably didn’t work because they probably just hired a ton of people to make this stuff so whenever if you go to the website you can kind of tell some of their technology is janky what i would do is i would use something like import.io or another third-party service like that and i wouldn’t build too much technology i would only have uh my only technology that i would build was a pretty interface that pulls it all together but i think you can build most of the stuff using zapier import.io airtable things like that i think that you could build like a pretty robust mvp that you could charge money for using things like this and so i probably didn’t make money because they probably their staff was just a bloated staff the company was founded in 2010 so when they launched a lot of this technology that third party technology wasn’t available and so i think they just have a bloated staff that was mostly doing manual work to go and find these types of people um yeah okay i can see that uh this cool service i’ve never actually heard of wealth x so uh i’m gonna go read the report i think that’s that’s pretty dope uh by the way i wanna say one other thing on the community side that we were talking about going back um i don’t think communities are great big businesses that’s what i mean community of communities of communities can be great big businesses discord is a community of communities reddit is a community of communities and both of those are like 10 billion ish sized companies and so if you can build and so that’s why i actually think collab land like if i was going to put money somewhere and go put it in collab land not in france with benefits same page the platform you’re using to launch all these different communities that has the potential to be much bigger than any one of these random tokens i don’t know who the [ ] is buying friends benefits this might be a thing that they could just manipulate themselves by the way i have no idea i think these thinly traded things could be uh potentially i’m saying they did i’m just saying who the heck is bidding up the price like this it doesn’t make a ton of sense to me um but yeah my main point is that community of communities are better businesses than an individual one once a community one’s a technology company so my point of bringing it up was collab land i would rather invest in but i wouldn’t i think that you can own a community that does 10 or 20 in sales and is profitable but yeah you’re not gonna you’re not going to knock it out the park with that business all right what do you got uh all right let’s do another one um let’s do uh okay i have a little like hot girl side hustle so we’ve done blue collar side hustle we’ve done teenage you know the puberty side side hustle and now this is my hot girl side hustle so i’m just trying to identify simple things that anybody who’s in a certain demographic can do that will generate you know 10 to 50 000 a month of profit without big upfront costs or like specific hard skills that you need to have and i’m not going to say only fans although that is definitely a hot girl side hustle so this hot girl side hustle is a little bit different there are uh i don’t know if you you kind of follow this too much actually you do because i think you guys run ads like this the dominant way to advertise for products now because you’re advertising on social networks the dominant way to advertise is not super high production value uh call yeah it’s selfie content right ugc is what they call i call it selfie because it’s ugc who the [ ] knows what that means so user generated content basically and they’re not doing companies aren’t just doing this on social at this point if you look at a commercial on tv for chime it’s the same thing well yeah the digital first companies when they go to tv like chime right first spent 100 million dollars on digital and now they go to their first tv spot and their whole company has been trained of like hey you know what works when it just looks like a normal person talking because an ad people just get sort of blind to an ad that just blaze right over it and so what works really well like i see this with with you guys with morning brew which basically like it’s a tick tock ad and the person’s you know my secret to getting my boss to think i’m super smart and then it’s like i [ ] i subscribe to the hustle and it’s like that gives me the news every morning and i look really smart that that that ad crashes that tag line like so morning brew does it the skim does it the hustle does it um all of everyone who’s in the the email space does that you know who invented that or who who first used that line no i wrote that i wrote that i wrote that i stole it from an old ad book i wrote that in 2016 i think i stole it from an old ad book of like um something about a guy being a piano player uh there was like a piano lesson ad from the 1960s about being a great piano player he goes uh he thinks i’m naturally a great piano player i’m not i really just use this this lesson or this way of learning music and i took that and i applied it here now everyone uses it well that’s kind of genius because that’s not even like a word for word right that’s actually like quite a different thing but you got inspired by it yeah it’s called swipe files so i keep swipe files so um i keep uh uh digital files of all my favorite favorite old ads so for for example there’s this one great ad about the wall from the wall street journal and they it’s made them like 50 million dollars in recurring revenue and it was launched in like the 70s and it was called like the tale of two young men and it was like both of these young men went to the same college they had similar jobs um one did this and one did that one earned this one earned that what where the difference one bought the wall street journal subscription their freshman year of college and uh that’s like the whole the story of the ad and like the headline is like the why did these two young men do the almost the exact same thing but and so so we should run that same ad for the podcast and we should be like basically that one listened to one listen to my first million one didn’t uh one became a millionaire by 30 and the other one you know is still still like hoping that retirement kicks in you know at 65. uh we should run that same ad and then we should when you click it we should tell the backstory of the ad basically and it’s a great story it’s a great work so i keep a file full of these types of things so anyway go ahead by the way if people want to see uh go to swipefile.com our friend neville owns swipefile.com which is a great little domain to have and he’s built like a pretty [ ] awesome wordpress digital swipe file i wish mine was like that my mine is like in my notes app and i have a slack channel that’s where i keep my swipes but like if i could i would i would have one like that but he’s got tons of great stuff there okay going back to actually this marketing thing by the way that uh i kind of want to give you more props that’s kind of a genius way to market the hustle right so how would a normal person a purchase they would say hustle to daily newsletter so i’m going to say sign up for our daily newsletter get the news delivered to you every morning right like that they would focus on the product and you focused on basically the happy ending and even the happy ending you didn’t just say and now you’re informed because that doesn’t like get people emotionally to like register at all right uh what you’re basically saying is what’s the outcome you want you want to look smart in front of your boss you want to look smart at work we help you look smart at work you know read the hustle if you want to look smart at work you like drew this line is that how you think about it that’s how i think about it how do you think about or exactly what’s your framework basically um one user told me one time that they were in a job interview for lyft and they brought up a certain line like a certain story at the end of an interview that wasn’t going well and that created a relationship with this person interviewing her and there’s like okay great i’m in this person’s head we were able to have chit chat thank you also you made me look smart and so the idea here is um i wanted a story but i i only wanted to be able to tell that story in like 200 characters and so i believe the original ad was like my boss thinks i’m a smart parenthesis i’m not um the hustle is my secret weapon to trick them though it’s working wonderfully try it or something like that and yeah that was the whole idea behind behind the ad that’s amazing that ad has reached 300 million people i think at this point [Laughter] yeah and then everybody copied it but you know whatever you do what you gotta do so uh okay what was i talking about before this i was talking about um oh take time okay so so uh you know what i was trying to get to was basically that my hot girl side hustle the one i was trying to get to is almost all digital advertisers have realized that this selfie style content that looks like native content if you’re on tic tac it’s going to look like it’s going to be a funny or cute or interesting or amazing video or if it’s on instagram it’s gotta look like an instagram post on facebook it’ll look like a facebook post those perform better than your professional commercials your professional ads that look highly polished people just skip past the polish stuff because they’re looking for entertainment so you have to look like the type of entertainment that looks like that’s native on the platform so this has created a shortage of people who can create great on script on brand selfie content and so i know this for our brand but many many brands everybody is trying to farm this out to either influencers or agencies the agencies are like look we we can run your ads but like making this creative takes a lot of time and energy and thought and like we don’t have actors and like a place a nice house to do this in so the hot girl side hustle is this there’s this girl on twitter her name social savannah if you go look her up she’s like a kind of like a i’ll help your brand grow through facebook ads through tick-tock ads and she’s what she’s not doing or what she does some of but it’s not the important part is like i do brand strategy i do advertising strategy well guess what a lot of a lot of agencies pitch that same thing we will we will manage you we’ll run your ads we’ll be your ad agency what she does that’s different is she basically is it’s her and i think she has like a couple of other like girls with her that do this they’re like send us the product and then we’ll take a bunch of these selfie videos and we will be the actor in your content and because i know what ads work i know what to say on here and i just look like an average person and that’s why this ad is going to work because i just look like an average person i’m not like um i like i have i can make i can get somebody’s attention when they’re scrolling but i don’t look like an actor in a set with a perfe professional camera and a professional background i look like a girl in our house so this is my if you’re a college student if you’re a college girl specifically there are a huge number of brands that will pay you don’t try to become instagram famous become instagram ad famous and what that means is be the person who can take any product and just do a demo a sales pitch and a testimonial and create branded ad content and you can charge thousands of dollars a month and you can charge even a percentage of the ad spend uh for this which is kind of insane if you’re good how much do you think flow from the progressive commercial gets paid a year oh my god i i don’t even know if this depends how good her agent is but you know they’re spending tens of millions easily on that campaign she’s like a branded part of it like if you swi if you switched out flow it’d be like hey wait that’s not flow who the heck is that it’s like uh you don’t know this but there’s this children’s cartoon that’s like the second most video watch video on youtube it’s called blippi have you ever heard of blip it’s like baby shark but like blippi is this guy and what he does is he goes into like toy stores after they’re closed and he films a video of himself playing with all the toys and it’s like mesmerizing for like my daughter she can’t look away when like blippi can play for an hour it’s like you’re playing with the toys you’re just watching him and then like halfway through like the youtube channel they just switched the guy and all the parents are like who the hell is this guy like this guy’s you could just switch blippi and like i could see this it’s not like there’s a new barney under the hood it’s like so kids can’t tell or at least like at the age of my daughter she’s too like she can’t tell maybe like a four-year-old can tell or something like that but but the parents always have to sit there with it and so like there’s tons of online forums where people are like uh did you see that they tried to just switch blippi on us like that like whatever so basically yeah i don’t know if they can switch flow at this point maybe they can maybe they can’t like the old spice guy the dos equis guy these become like part of the actual like to become like non-fungible you know parts of the of the ad i think this is great for this woman how much money thinks she should make in this this uh what’s her name social savannah i have no idea i mean if you told me she’s making fifty to a hundred thousand dollars a month i would say yeah that sounds about right if you told me she’s making a little bit less i’d say she’s probably going to be at 50 to 100 000 a month soon why because brands need this content i don’t want to have to arrange photo shoots or put myself in front of the camera i just want to send you know product to this person once a month and they sit there in their bedroom and they record a new ad every day and then i have 30 pieces of creative at the end of the month by the end of the month that i’m testing on facebook and i’m saying this one works this one doesn’t do more like this um and that’s what i want this woman is perfect she is perfect this is so here’s why here’s why she’s perfect uh she’s perfect because so i’ve run uh my team had we’ve run eight figures in ads a lot of ads i personally have probably ran five million maybe eight million so like a fair amount of um when we first started i i ran a lot of them my our podcast we’ve gotten accused of being bros i’m just going to say what i’m going to say but don’t like hate me this is just the truth okay this is just the truth okay so we would have three different types of ads well actually four a hot guy like a good-looking but not like hot like an everyday next door type of guy right from the office yeah the the equivalent for a woman so like a a pretty girl next door woman and then like a smoking hot like traditional yeah yeah or at least like the stereotype of like this like you know whatever you like what you think a model looks like if you’re gonna make a have a model for your brand yes for both men and women the pretty next door girl worked significantly better significantly it always works and so that shocked me it worked amongst both men and women and when i look at this woman i’m thinking in my head this is she’s like kind of exactly the the ads that that we run they look like this woman the ones that won at least exactly uh that’s exactly it so even though i called it my hot girl side hustle it’s really not a hot girl study it’s actually should be called more like the reason actually the way i was thinking about this was approachable yeah girl next door side hustle basically and if you if you are like cute basically that’s the bar um because you have to get somebody’s attention when they’re scrolling and the way the social media works whether people like this or not if this is a controversial statement like get over yourself the way social media works is um react to or they stop or they pause when they see somebody attractive in their feed right we’re like monkeys just scrolling through our feed and so uh so so that’s why i think you have to be certain level of attractiveness but really the most important part is the thing has to look like somebody just like posting something from their their account not a branded thing and that works the best so anyways i think this is an easy way to get to five to ten thousand dollars a month easily and i think the upside can be a hundred thousand dollars if you’re gonna manage a group of people like there’s some people who are on college campuses that are smart they know how to put other people on campus to work for them you could easily get this to six figures a month of income and it’s almost all profit i i don’t know this woman but we run in the same circle so this woman i’m looking it up now so there’s a guy named taylor holiday and i forget the other person’s name but they’re listeners of the podcast they follow both of us on twitter and they used to run this company called common thread collective and i think it’s just an agency right it’s just an agency they seem like great guys and i looked up social savannah on linkedin so her name’s savannah sanchez this woman and she used to work at that company as a paid manager and yep uh and i imagine what happened when she was there was they were like hey we got to create these ads and then somehow it came to like oh savannah you’re like you’re you’re like good looking and you’re charismatic and you’re creative like let’s just use you and she was like okay fine and then she actually kind of learned how the business worked a little bit while she was there and this is how she started this agency this is amazing i’m totally on board with this yeah it basically unbundles the ad agency so the ad agency does they do creative but then when they use when they do creative they usually farm it out to a photographer videographer or another another creative ad agency whatever uh they’ll do media like strategy like what’s your buying strategy how much you’re gonna how are you gonna structure your campaigns what’s your budgets et cetera uh they do like reporting client reports all that [ ] then they’re like oh you need to be on google facebook snapchat we’ll we’ll manage all those we’ll put it all in one place for you we’ll keep it all organized and the smart thing is that somebody just unbundled and said man the most important part of this whole thing is the ad creative that’s also the part where you don’t have to do almost any of the like client services and that undifferentiated stuff and um and the good part about this is that if you are good at it um it’s like sandwich video where basically you get known as the the group to go to that’s who the d2c companies go to so i think there’s like an opportunity in that to become like the sandwich video for for d2c and look at the link i just sent to you in zencaster of the people who worked there all right let’s take a look employees three employees yeah okay yeah they all look they all fit the profile yes yeah i love this company yeah exactly like if i could invest in this company i’d be like hey great just i don’t want to not long term like give me a monthly dividend out of this company and i’ll be very very happy i think i’ll make my money back in six months god this is great all right you want to do one more thing yeah let’s do one more all right all right let’s do i’ll do a more high tech one okay so we did the bro bro science one i’ll give you kind of like a a cool um technology one so cool technology one is more blue-collar actually there’s a whole bunch of blue-collar jobs around construction sites like forklifts um whatever the big i don’t even know what they’re called like tractors like the things that dig up dirt cement trucks whatever dude dolly parton was did anyone email you and say like what the [ ] your problem no they nobody emailed me because nobody else knows about dolly parton either unless unless you come from a certain part of america no i’m just joking i think a lot of people do know and they were just like rolling their eyes like how does this guy not know this um so the the thing i was going to bring up is on construction sites you have a lot of these uh heavy machinery drivers basically so drivers of forklift drivers have cranes things like that and these are really expensive labor and it takes skill and it’s also dangerous right and so i think what’s going to happen is if you just fast forward 10 20 years from now i think all of this gets replaced with this technology that’s it’s not self-driving it’s more like self-operating um which is basically like remote uh or what they call tele-operated so have you ever seen a tele-operated thing have you ever seen a demo of this yeah so um i forget what they’re called but basically i remember about in 2015 i went to my friend’s office aj and it was called i cracked and he had an office in new york and an office in san luis obispo or sorry san francisco in new york or something like that and he had this like thing you know remember like a hoverboard like the two wheels yeah and he had like a stick coming up from it and then an ipad and basically what you could do is you could use your iphone and you could be remote and you could have this like screen hover around the office and you could be looking at it from your phone and talk to people so you can go into like different rooms things like that and they also have them at stores now so some stores are fully operated by those things yeah there’s a there’s a i we used to have one at our office it was kind of like a j nobody really used it but yeah that was like it was like a segway but it’s like an ipad on top of it and anybody who’s not there could like roll around the office in theory so it’s a similar sort of idea but basically there’s a set of technologies that say hey look self-driving like full ai that’s hard and far away but what we can do is we can basically have a we can do kind of like a labor arbitrage so you can have like a driver city you know instead of being in los angeles where labor might be expensive you have a driver in santa fe or a driver in the philippines doesn’t matter and basically the driver can basically drive and you could drive a full car so there’s like eight cameras the driver is basically looking at it like it’s a video game like they have three monitors the front monitor is the front windshield the left monitors if you looked at the left window and looked at your rear view mirror and the right one is the right one and basically they just drive and like the they’ve gotten this down low latency where you can have a i can go sit in a car i’ve done this i sat in a car that was being driven by somebody at a computer somewhere else that i had never met that i never knew and he drove me around the parking lot no problem parked the car and i got out and i was like oh that’s cool that’s uber but the driver’s not here the driver is a video game player somewhere else and um and then that gets even better because okay that’s that takes advantage of geography right maybe i make 25 an hour here and i can pay 12 an hour in another city but still that’s like kind of a lot of technology and risk for just saving you know 12 an hour so then they go next level they say well you know we really only need the driver when they’re at a an intersection trying to make a left turn or trying to park so but like on a highway or you know in a straight road very simple stuff the computer can just do it fascinating super accurately so what they do is it’s like the deep sentinels like the security company that you invest in where one security guard monitors a hundred different doors because for a security guard they only need to look when there’s a when there’s a person at the door if there’s no person at the door the screen’s off and so what deep sentinel did was smart was they made it where like you have like a super a super agent who instead of just a bodyguard monitoring or security officer monitoring one location they can monitor 100 at a time similarly with this technology you have things driving and then only when the computer is confused or gets into a defined situation that’s like uh hey this is a left turn we only trust humans to do left turns right now then it pops up on the driver’s screen the driver says great i will take over from here they do the left turn and then they say back to autopilot and then the thing drives off again and so that’s called human in the loop technology where there’s it’s mostly ai but then there’s a human in the loop of doing the process so human in the loop is super interesting most people view it as like a just a band-aid like a bridge until we get to full ai but i think there’s going to be big companies that just do human of the loop stuff and one of the human of the loop things that i think is going to happen is remote operated heavy machinery on construction sites because if you take the people away you reduce a lot of the danger you reduce the skill requirement and then maybe you you only need an operator to do certain high skill tasks and they just like basically load in like a video game they do the task and then they leave and then they go do it again so one driver can be like working on 10 construction sites every day i think that’s going to be pretty cool because that person will make they’ll make three times more what’s that somebody down there so there’s a couple different companies that are doing this there’s some that are doing this with uh construction i don’t know their names then there’s a company that’s just doing teletelly operation as a service so basically it says hey you want to you want to create a company doing tele-operated forklifts cool um or cranes great put our kit on your on your crane and it’ll work put our software kit wow this is this is what your driver sitting somewhere else is going to use is our our camera kit basically um and that’s a company called i want to say it’s like shadow or something let me see that’s pretty great as a service um phantom phantom dot auto is a is one of the companies now i don’t i’ve heard some you know mixed things i don’t know if it’s a great company this is a former yc partner left to go start this they raised a bunch of money who uh they’re trying to do it for self-driving cars what do you say who who uh i gotta look him up phantom auto founder and what were the mixed things uh well some people are just like you know anybody who’s gonna do this they end up building this in-house they don’t actually like self-driving is you have so many engineers you’re working on this so hard and your your use case might be different and so uh they’re skeptical that a third party can provide the software that every one of these companies going to use because it’s not like there’s going to be millions of companies that need this it’s more like dozens of companies today that need this and all dozens of those companies are probably going to do this in-house um want to say phantom was done by the ycga maybe it’s something else but maybe i’m thinking maybe i’m mixing up two of these no i think i think i’m mixing up two of these there was a different yc founder doing this so really quick there’s this company called winner winner so winner winner dot com have you ever been there yep i’ve checked it out but explain it because it’s pretty cool it’s pretty cool so joe spicer you know our friend he’s uh maybe a co-founder or helped get it going but basically what they do is they have a warehouse in las vegas well so how cheap is a las vegas warehouse you would know more than i do do you know i mean it’s dirt cheap so like you could have like i think ramon had a massive like many tens of thousands of square feet for like 20 grand a month and then these guys so these guys rented this massive warehouse and then they filled it with claw machines and you could play a claw machine like you see the camera there’s a camera on it and you could play this claw machine uh virtually from your phone and then when you pull a gift i actually don’t know you’ve done it what happens when you win a gift they’ll mail it to you so like you basically you buy credits and then you like play the thing and then if you win the toy you can uh you can basically pay i think you i think you have to be at a certain level to get the free shipping but otherwise you like pay to have the the toy shipped to you and so it’s it’s a it’s an arcade you can play from far away and it’s a tele-operated little claw that goes down and picks up the items it sounds silly but these are actually really popular games uh both in the u.s but also in japan i think this is like a pretty big market for this either in korea or japan and then winner winner their numbers were pretty like decent as well like they’re doing they’re doing very well i think you guys invested right no we haven’t but they’re thinking about we don’t know if there’s going to be a a um conflict of interest we’re trying to figure it out but they’re investible you know like it’s getting to that size yeah it’s it’s a really cool concept uh it’s definitely worth like playing with once just to see it kind of like makes you think more is possible than you thought of right like it’s kind of a crazy idea to be like hey you know that little like two dollar thing where you can like maybe win an iphone or like a stuffed animal like yeah what if you could just play that from your phone i don’t think this was that hard to set up either like no i don’t think it’s either they say like because little things do matter like latency or like if i push right and it doesn’t go right until like it lags but by then i push right three more times now it goes right three times and i’m like you can easily just get frustrated throw your phone and be like this is stupid so there’s definitely some tech you have to do to smoothen that out but that’s getting better and better every day and um any any group of smart people can solve that that’s a lot easier than you know self-driving cars or whatever but i think this whole space to watch is tele operation remote operation remote drivers remote arcade games remote you know construction remote cleaning there’s a whole bunch of things where the machine can do 80 of the stuff the machine can’t do the last 20 so instead of just waiting until the machine is perfect you say cool we’re going to put a human in the loop the human will take over when that 20 needs to be done when a decision needs to be made when an adjustment needs to be done or whatever and then the machine goes back to doing it and now you have humans that are working remotely they make more money than they would if they were just working on one site and the cost of the thing goes down too because you don’t need so many humans working on stuff to make it work so i think it’s like a win-win-win that’s going to be more popular but people don’t really talk about that today do you follow do you know how much on it sold for you know on it yeah joe rogan’s like thing uh you had told me something they sold for a couple hundred million right dude someone told me like 200 million dollars right is that crazy so on its own by this guy named aubry marcus do you follow him on instagram no should i this guy is nuts i’ve heard some crazy stories about this guy like i don’t meta when i say nuts i don’t i think he’s a fine guy um but he’s just like an oddball i’ve heard some stories about him that basically one time he went to uh this uh rural area and went into an isolation area but it wasn’t like an isolation tank it was like a um a room with no sound or no uh light and he stayed there for like four or five days i’ve heard other stories about how he goes to this area it does massive amounts of lsd i’ve heard stories about how he had an open relationship with his wife and it didn’t work out and she was like i believe her name’s whitney i think she’s like a former miss america something like that and they had an open relationship this guy is wild if you follow him on on instagram and he’s like he’s like a hunk like he’s like looks really good looking like he’s good-looking and he like heard the word hunk in a long time dude he’s like a hunk he’s like ripped he’s huge he’s good-looking he’s got like cool tattoos this guy you got to follow this guy i did script it’s wild this is like some weird [ ] i’m watching him i’m watching him work out with a steel mace yeah that’s what they said warriors used to use and there’s like videos of him with like war paint on and then um this guy he this is the most this guy’s so fascinating to me i love the founders of all these companies so like if you want to see interesting founders look at the founders of supplement companies um you know like energy drink companies like go look at the guy from bang energy dude tell me that’s not a good time tell me that’s not a good time on instagram go look at the guys who do supplements uh the energy guy is like legit weird yeah all these guys are legit weird dude and that doesn’t mean like it’s not a bad thing but they’re not they’re not like you know some corporate they run big corporations but they’re not corporate they are not buttoned up they are uh they’re a little wild yeah man this is a good follow you got to follow aubrey marcus he like he does all this spiritual stuff like there’s here’s a video of him um he’s getting um like blessed by a spiritual shaman or something i don’t even understand like some of this terminology um and all right i have a good follow for you too on instagram of a tech founder do you follow the founder of telegram powell no is he is he a nutty okay so we just type in p-a-v-e-l he’s the ceo of telegram yeah telegram if you don’t know it telegram is basically whatsapp but it’s made by this kind of like guy who’s he won’t sell the company so he’s like this guy’s actually kind of like a genius i think he started vk which is the the russian facebook it’s the only country d-u-r-o-v uh and his handle is just d-u-r-o-v yeah i got him so so this guy’s story is pretty nuts uh so he starts vk naomi vk is the uh the russian facebook facebook the facebook basically has taken over every other like oh i’m facebook for brazil it was like orc no facebook comes wins it’s like oh i’m facebook for like bibo bibo was facebook and ireland in the uk and in australia boom facebook won and then in russia they just could never beat vk for like a combination of like slightly political reasons but also i’ve seen interviews with zuckerberg where he’s like dude they’re engineers these are like the most brilliant mathematicians ever and they’ve just made it their mission in life as soon as we release anything they haven’t copied in 24 hours like it’s and it’s like pixel for pixel copy so vk is facebook but instead of blue it’s red it’s like a pixel for pixel copy of facebook but it’s red and it it has withstood facebook facebook has not been able to win in russia even after like all this time but then you know putin or whoever the government there they basically took over vk they just like took over the company and like demanded certain things he refused and so this guy had to flee the country so this guy flees and he creates telegram which is this like ideal this is like encrypted messaging app and it’s like whatsapp but it’s uh not owned by facebook so a lot of people like it i love it it’s great product and he basically self-funded it for a long time like he’s put like 50 million of his own money into like doing he’s like there’s no ads there’s no whatever and then he made a bunch of money when they did an ico a token sale but they never actually went through with it but they got free money for a while from that uh but this dude’s instagram following is hilarious you’ll never see anyone else in his instagram feed no friend no girlfriend boyfriend wife kid nothing it’s only him it’s usually him with no shirt on and he’s pretty ripped and he’s he’s very ripped i mean he looks like first he is always doing like model-esque photo shoots dude he’s like vito he’s like sitting on a sand dune or he’s like riding a horse into the sunset like he’s in a speedo under a waterfall and uh this guy is just hilarious to follow i just find this guy to be like an actual character no he’s 36 years old worth 20 billion dollars and he’s got like pictures of him like with this mega yeah this guy’s fascinating i’m gonna i’m gonna successfully this is the billy of the week pavel pavel you are the billy of the week so where’s he live just for he floats around he doesn’t tell anyone where he lives he’s in dubai a lot but he travels around and he doesn’t he can’t go back to russia and he can’t go he can’t go back to the state he can’t come to the states doesn’t want to come to the states and so he just goes to like you know beautiful places that are you know uh i don’t know if he lives in one place he’s just like always traveling it’s him sometimes in the u.s sometimes in dubai finland brazil wherever paris and then uh he runs the company sort of like remotely so wikipedia says i don’t know this word um aesthetic like what’s that mean aesthetic i guess that means you don’t know own much and he won’t give up your possessions he promotes freedom of property so i guess he doesn’t own uh that much stuff yeah wow yeah he ran some nice [ ] i’ll tell you that much so he’s renting like a like a mega yeah probably a 100 million dollar yacht this guy’s fascinating and his kind of like mission in life is just sort of to be like the anti-facebook anti-vk and so i find him to be cool because he’s like an idealist like if you use telegram he writes the update and he’ll be like we have you know 10 million more members uh telegram remains 100 free 100 encrypted 100 uh you know like um uh what’s it called like you know independent and he’s like you know we release these new features and he’s just like he definitely has like an idealistic streak around privacy yeah around freedom at least that’s what he promotes and this company is like a 20 billion dollar company right or like a multi-billion dollar startup telegram would be a multi-billion dollar startup but again there’s no there’s no outside investors and there’s no uh he’ll never sell so you know it’s nobody knows the real value this might be one of the most valuable companies per employee i’m looking at their jobs page they only have like five jobs up a content moderator a translator a translator a junior accountant an assistant to the ceo dude that’s a sick job if you can become an assistant if paul’s a ceo that’s a sick job that’s crazy right yeah what’s that interesting company does it make money uh no it doesn’t make any money he doesn’t care about it making money he doesn’t want it to make money they did they were like pretty pure until they did this ico thing they basically did yeah yeah they were like we’re going to beat ethereum we’re going to like build a better version of ethereum uh with all this crazy [ ] they released this white paper that was like we are solving all these impossible computer science things and people who were smart technically they were like all right well like if anyone’s gonna do it it’s gonna be these guys but i don’t think i don’t think anybody can do this and definitely nobody can do this in this timeline that they’re talking about um like the crazy sharding schemes or whatever and basically they um so so so they did this ico i think they raised like four billion dollars or three billion dollars i have some of the details wrong i never i didn’t prepare for this one but they raised a few billion dollars and then the u.s basically said you yeah you can’t that’s a security offering you can’t do that unless you follow these regulations and so they just pulled the plug on the ico but for a year they held everyone’s money saying it’s going to get listed at the end of the year or two years maybe even they helped everybody so they had like a free float of a multi-billion dollar float for multiple years and then they gave back the money but for the deal was so hard to get into that all these middlemen who had allocation i think you had to buy 20 million dollar slots uh that was like the minimum purchase at the time i think people would buy the 20 million and then they would sell chunks of it to individual retail investors like me for 30 million a 40 million total and so people got back the 20 million but if they sold it for more than that initial strike price you were screwed so a lot of people put in you know a hundred thousand dollars into this thing and got back 70 two years later um you know but that’s the risk you take i’m gonna be researching this all day um yeah that’s the episode i gotta run cool all right see you later