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Kind: captions Language: en [Music] all right um let’s do this i’ve got a few things to talk about but first sean let’s talk to ben ben had a big night why are we even talking we are now the sideshow we’re the openers actually for the main event ben ben made event wilson what’s up dude how are you feeling well let’s let’s let’s not even tell them why so here here’s the here’s the setup sean and i were chilling last night and we get a text from ben and he says hey look who just followed me and it was mr beast and i think it’s so for context everyone ben is our producer here ben has a podcast called how to take over the world it’s uh it’s fairly popular but growing quickly so uh your twitter only has like a thousand or two thousand followers right four thousand four still yeah four thousand so we get this message and you said hey look who uh look who just started following me and it was mr beast and sean and i made fun of you saying like uh you know that’s nothing no big deal then you sent a text message to us saying uh been on the phone with them for the past hour and a half and we were like wait what and we don’t really know we don’t know anything else so yeah of course there’s gonna be some stuff here that you can’t talk about but what happened yeah so uh i got back from utah with my in-laws on saturday so i was like feeling a little jet lagged i was about to go to bed early getting into bed with my wife and uh i looked down on my phone and i’ve got a notification says mr beast followed you and my first thought is like oh yeah mr beast followed me like mr underscore beast hey give me my social security number and i’ll venmo you five thousand dollars so i literally i saw it and i just put down my phone and uh like keep just like chatting with my wife or whatever and then i pick it up five minutes later and i look at it and i go i actually don’t see an underscore i don’t i don’t see anything wrong with this and i click on it and it’s verified and it’s mr beast and he just followed me and i was like oh that’s weird like you said i only have 4 000 followers like it’s not it’s not a normal thing for like i just you know pick up mr beast and then i get a dm like two minutes later and uh he’s like hey um i listened to your podcast i think it’s cool i would love to chat sometime i don’t want anything from you i just like want to learn and i was like so i respond i say cool yeah let’s uh talk anytime i’m free like anytime you want to talk next week you sound like you’re playing it cool but inside what’s going on yeah so inside i was like actually even outside i was like my wife is katie like katie katie katie once it starts happening and uh she was like what and i was like mr beast’s following me she’s like what’s a mr beast and i was like no i gotta call someone else that’s what i texted you guys because like she doesn’t get it i need to talk to someone who gets it katie leave the room like go get me a 12 year old stat who could have a discussion about this katie get your nephew on the line yeah uh she’s getting mad at me if i talk about her though once i explained who he was she was very very excited she was very very excited um so uh i uh i messaged him yeah and i’m like trying to play cool like uh oh yeah cool i could i could make time no problem um and uh should i run or crawl to you and then he hits me with the sean and he’s like uh how about right now and i’m like sitting there like in my boxers in my bed and i’m like yep i am 100 ready to talk right now uh calm call me and uh so he called me apparently he does this uh at night he goes for walks and he just calls people who he thinks are interesting and he tries to like download their brains and learn anything that he can uh so uh we talked for like almost two and a half hours uh at the end and he’s a very cool dude and i learned a lot of cool stuff well what like well and yeah i mean what did you guys talk about uh we talked about a lot like it was you know it was just like a personal conversation so i’m not gonna share everything that we talked about but um oh i mean what for me the the coolest thing he did was yeah i’ve i’ve known for a long time that i need to take my podcast to youtube and i got to ask him like okay so how should i do this and he basically walked me through how he would do it um and how would he do it general game plan uh basically i was saying you know should i do segments should i do uh clips should i um animate it should i do me on the screen and what he said is do the full episodes uh you probably want to edit the scripts a little bit so that it’s not quite so casual uh because podcast like you listen to as you’re washing the dishes like it doesn’t matter that it’s not gripping every second of the of the audio but for youtube like it does need to be gripping every second like really needs to pull people second by second so he said you need to edit your script a little bit for video do animations do it highly produced and do the full episodes like 45 minutes to an hour long that was the basic strategy and then he gave me some comps some channels that i should make it similar to some homework up on what did he want to ask you right because he called you so um you know was he looking for something was he just saying hey tell me about you know i’m walking around i want to hear i’ve listened to your podcast and i decided i’d like you to say it out loud to me live go like what was he what was he interested in he was laying in bed and he said ben tell me about my heroes yeah and uh uh no he yeah he the funny thing was he didn’t really know so we were just like talking about random stuff and he’s like i just want to learn from you so i don’t know what’s up man like that’s kind of how we went into it and i was like i don’t know what’s up with you um and uh so then we just kind of started chatting about random topics i asked him a lot of stuff i he told me a lot of cool stuff that is not public information and then at the end he was asking me sort of about um like guru is honestly very similar i told you about that finance guy yeah yeah and like wants me to be his guru the background is very similar the background of that is like this person worth hundreds of millions of dollars hollered at ben and said just tell me what mistakes i’m going to make before i make them based off of like historical people so ben’s podcast is he basically reads three books on titans of industry and he breaks them down into like a two or three hour podcast so so by in theory ben’s an expert a three book expert on a lot of different people and and if you’re gonna listen to one go listen to edison i think it’s amazing sam what’s your favorite one edison to me is by far my favorite uh what’s the uh richest uh roth child i like the rothschild one but i do think the edison one is the is the most impactful because it like we all know the outcome of edison the disney one people liked um i didn’t like that as much because disney like is not as interesting to me but uh that one’s probably the most popular so interestingly i for disney i almost did a follow-up at the end of it because i listened to mr b’s interview on joe rogan and the stuff mr beast was saying i was like oh this person is so similar to walt disney that it’s almost kind of spooky and maybe i should make uh a podcast just pointing out like a a quick 10 minute one pointing out the similarities between walt disney and mr beast and when he got on the phone he was like i loved the walt disney one that really resonated with me and i was like oh that doesn’t matter dude this is why like you you’re you’re you’re pretty under monetized but i think it’s gonna catch up soon because i think what’s gonna happen and we said this six months ago you make these comments like oh you remind me of walt disney and so if i’m the person who like if i’m mr beast and you said it to me i go really what um what mistake like what am i doing wrong um or like uh i’m thinking about doing x y and z did walt do this and like did it work and did it not work like you’re this weird fortune teller type of person and that did he say something like that to you yeah a little bit um a little bit he got into the like well what mistakes should i look out for like what do you think that um like what do you think i need to be wary of there’s and like there’s a charlie munger quote that’s like um tell me where i’m gonna die so i know i never go there right like i’ll just make sure never to go there it’s kind of that but i’m sure there’s also the upside right like it’s not just what mistakes but like how did they make their greatness happen i think that’s actually more of what people care about how do they make their greatness happen and then kind of draw parallels to my own life of like yeah i am just like edison and the rothschilds and disney after all you know uh it’s so similar right i think you know like for mr beast i think the parallels are super easy with walt disney the thing the only time that walt disney slowed down in his career was for like a decade and it was because walt loved to be working on a new thing but a certain point everyone convinced him like oh actually you have this enormous multi-million dollar animation studio now you just need to be working on pumping out more full-length animations like when he did that the whole thing kind of went downhill and then he goes crazy and he starts obsessing over little toy trains and like really going off the rails but those those model trains then get bigger and bigger and becomes disneyland and that is when he comes out of his funk and starts innovating again and so for mr beast it’s just like the don’t let anyone convince you that you need to be working on the reasonable thing like you need to follow your unreasonable passions because some somehow great things are going to come out so that’s kind of the parallel for context walt disney i can’t imagine he was more successful than mr beast was at mr b stage but how big was his business when it when you say things were going were being becoming unsuccessful and he started focusing and what does focusing mean like was he was he the ceo of this company um walt was essentially the ceo of walt disney studios yeah uh and this is basically in the 40s and early 50s and it was not huge huge but it was like hundreds to maybe just over a thousand employees is how big wow well disney studios was damn dude well ben i think this was cool as hell i’m so happy for you that that happened these are cool moments along the way and sit kind of like signals that like you’re on the right track uh you know sam discovered you i don’t know when uh he came on a year ago it was a year ago and you did this awesome there’s somebody put a twitter clip up you did some interview and you were like you’re like i’m listening to my first million and i hear sam say uh man i found this podcast i love it’s called how to take over the world and i thought to myself huh there’s another podcast called how to take over the world how cool is that and then you’re like oh [ ] he’s talking about me ben wilson he just said my name and then you know and then we basically then i went down the rabbit hole after sam said it i was like that sounds like really interesting i don’t like to read biographies but i think i’d like to listen to two hours and like that’s just you know like one commute and i could like know the story of edison i listened to the edison one i got hooked i called you basically right after that i think i dm’d you and called you and i was like hey let’s partner like i think your thing is going to blow up come work for us on our podcast and then we will help cross promote your broadcast and like let’s take this to the next level and these are the little happenings that happen along the way and now you know mr beast following you know sam and my lead of recognizing your talents for what they are and um and so you know honestly like i think you have a great thing going i’m really happy for you that you know this happened i think it’s such a cool thing that happened i think what would be cool and i think this might happen ben here’s what i’m going to predict that’s going to happen in the next month you’re going to record an episode with jimmy mr beast you’re going to record an episode with mr beast and i think you if you you should ask him you should text him be like hey next time you want to do a sunday talk can i just record it and we’re going to talk about history and i’m going to make it an episode do care and every it’s going to be really cool because it’s going to be like when elon musk went on um or wouldn’t like i forget it was like elon musk went on a couple like like uh he went on wait but why history hardcore history and it’s like dude well hardcore history is like bigger than you ben but the even to the mainstream person they were like why is elon musk appearing on this nerdy niche thing and it blows it up and that’s what’s gonna happen it’s gonna be all the young people are gonna be like why is mr beast on this history thing what is going on who is this and i think that’s what’s going to happen and your life is going to change i predict that’s that’s this is this is how that story is going to play out you should definitely reach out with some idea you just need to what’s what is the idea of how he could join you on the thing and like just get that one thing right and it’ll be like an inflection point for for you and what you do well it should be it should be why mr beast is the new walt disney and you’re going to be like hey i’m going to tell you i’m going to jimmy uh his name’s jimmy right i’m going to tell you why how you are just like walt disney but i’m going to do it in front of everyone and you can ask me questions and i’ll explain to you why uh that’s that’s why i think you are just like him i think that’ll be really cool i think what i would want to do is if he would let me like go down to north carolina and like interview his parents interview his friends and like actually kind of make like a semi-documentary audio documentary out of it the making of mr beast that would be sick and also you could it could be like this is the part one of may of hopefully many parts to come and i’m gonna do this you know i can i can kind of document your whole whole thing how this turns out but you’re only 20 what is he 25 26 years old something like that it’s like you know this is this is part one you know what’s funny part one i was talking to him and uh i was talking about like just look at the smile on your face bro this is like you know wow i have never seen this sort of deep happiness inside you this is amazing so i i was talking about like yeah these guys call me up and think i’m their guru and so like i’m i might do like a consulting business off of it um like coaching type of thing because peop there seems to be a market for that and he was like oh yeah i could see that that seems like something i would have gone for when i was younger and i was like when you were younger you’re 24 years old like how much time is there of when you were younger he’s like i used to feel just like that yesterday he’s like yeah when i was younger you’re like i have a child seven years older than you and i have a child all right i’ll be uh that’s funny he just big dogged you in a very nice way yeah he did did you a favor he he kind of like [ ] on you in the most gentle way possible in a way that’s helpful to you yes exactly well congratulations that’s cool all right i’m excited to see what’s going to happen all right sean i have what else we got i’ve got a few interesting things for you let me tell you the first interesting thing that i’m doing in my life and kind of an interesting business so i’m on this app called intro are you using intro i don’t use it no but uh let’s explain what it is it’s basically like you call an expert for an hour and you pay for the time and you could do like a 15 or 30 minute call with them yeah that’s all it is it’s that and that’s not the point of the story but that’s like that’s all it is it’s just you pay money to talk to people it’s consulting and my buddy started it so he asked me to do it so i said yeah fine i’ll sign up whatever so when you and i were in miami this man and woman this husband and wife came up to me and like started talking to me about hypnotherapy because they knew that i was uh afraid to fly i i’ve got like i have a pretty hardcore claustrophobic thing i don’t take subways i don’t fly and i also have an addictive personality and i love sugar and so they like knew that and they were trying to pitch me and they on like using their services and they kept emailing me and i just i ignore everyone i don’t reply to email really and eventually they book a intro call with me and i charge like i put it at like two grand an hour and they’re like hey you never answer our emails and and to be honest when i met them i did you know like you we do the nice thing when meet people oh yeah you know this sounds great like you know maybe i’ll do it sometime like you’re just trying to be polite and i just find a time yeah let’s find a time and let’s run away from potentially talking to each other yeah and they booked a call with me and they go you said you’re gonna do it we can’t get you down so we’re just gonna pay you money right now and we’re going to sit down and do a hypno a hip uh what’s it called hip what do you call it hypnosis i guess a hypnosis session and i’m like okay i don’t know what that what that’s about but i i do it and it kind of has changed my like the game for me and so what yes and i’ll explain to you what but uh i keep getting the words screwed up hypnotherapy what is it called hypnosis uh they uh this woman so she has an app her name is grace i think getgrace.com is like her app and then i don’t know i think like grace.tv if you go to getgrace.com i’m sure you’ll see all about her her name is grace and she told me she’s like look here’s the deal a handful of executives pay me a million dollars a year to do to be their personal hypnotist i’m not gonna pay you that or i’m not gonna charge you that but if you like it you have to tell people about it i said whatever fine but i’m not paying you a million dollars she’s like that’s fine but you just get let me give you five sessions and if it changes you let me know if you want to talk about it and so i do this do this thing it’s totally worked so basically what it is is you know how you do uh breath work and meditation you just like kind of like sit down and get quiet and like you hear like a voice in your head like it’s maybe your headphones it’s andy from headspace and he says like all right imagine like the sun is pouring on your mind or on your brain and it’s leaking down to your body and causing you to like relax and you’re filling with like relaxation whatever you basically do that but then she talks to you while you’re in that state you know that meditative state and she says things like you know imagine yourself on a beach in your safe space and imagine like there’s four-year-old you and you’re explaining to him how you’re trying to overcome like you know the sugar addiction or whatever the thing you’re trying to overcome and so uh and tell me what you say to that person so you’re basically just like talk you’re getting spoken to and you’re sometimes speaking back in a meditative state not like that interesting when i did it i was like oh i thought i was gonna be in a trance but for some reason this has been wildly effective i think it could be placebo i think it could not be but i don’t care i haven’t had sugar in like three weeks since i started this and i like am i kind of an addict with that stuff and it’s like to the point where i get sick if i think about it it’s been crazy fascinating and she gets these she gets all these people to pay her a million dollars a year is that is that real though who’s who’s paying her does she does she name names who’s paying her a million dollars a year that sounds a little far-fetched it does sound a bit far-fet fetched on her website is the founder of clearco uh clearco what are they called their they’re called like clear banker or something yeah they were uh that guy is uh one of her testimonials and then she told me other people who uh i actually don’t know if i’m allowed to say who those other people are oh yeah so that’s great her website yeah well her website is great grace gracesmithtv.com and on there you could see testimonials from people so could it she be like kind of pulling my leg yeah i mean i didn’t like look at her financials yes 100 but i don’t know who i mean would someone lie about that like it looks way different for some reason i imagine her to be like 70 but she’s not she’s very young so grace smith is the world’s leading hypnotherapist it is a seven figure investment to work with grace uh wow that’s amazing you can work with her team for less or download the grace app for free okay grace app for free that sounds promising all right so the uh the founder of clearbank wow she’s been on uh you know whatever something’s tv show jimmy kimmel but it’s not it’s called the noit contenilo gentilly it’s the brazilian version it’s the brazilian version of jimmy kimmel yeah so okay so yours was around sugar or was around for your sugar and we’re gonna we’re gonna address the the flying thing later but i was gonna try and do sugar and uh it’s actually been effective i’m i’m shocked to say it’s been effective that’s kind of crazy um i like it and it makes me want to do it which i think is probably you know pretty common she told me to tell you that you can do it for free too if you want oh okay great how do i get over my what do i even have i don’t have as much yeah the problem is is that you’re like emotionally healthy so i like i don’t know if you have issues um get over this happiness thing i got every day yeah so i don’t know if like it’s gonna impact you i don’t know like if you have any diet yeah it could be food it could be food related like you know do i really want that cheese pizza maybe i’ll just never eat a cheese pizza again after i talk to grace that could be kind of nice it’s it’s just kind of interesting but it could be a thing where it’s like man i gotta meet with this woman every week and like if i tell her that i ate sugar i’m to feel like an idiot so i mean that could be it i i don’t know what it is but it’s kind of interesting i started using that my body tutor after you had mentioned it on the podcast so did you really they definitely had a bump i signed up i paid for it so i was like all right let’s try this out it’s legit right now for multiple weeks it’s super legit i mean it’s like there’s no like hocus pocus it’s like just straight up here’s a kind of like a coach who’s a nutritionist who’s like gonna really help you so i have this woman haley helping me i don’t know if she’s the most same one you have i have heather okay so um i don’t know about heather but haley’s amazing and so uh and a lot of it’s just like the basic psychology of accountability right like i tell her i’m gonna do something and i take a photo of every meal and i have to think to myself am i gonna either a be a big fat liar and just not take a picture of this like you know bag of cheez-its that i’m about to eat or am i gonna take a picture of it and be like yeah i know i told you i was going to eat good and then i just ate bad even though clearly i could have just not you know not eaten bad and so it’s helped so much to clear up like you know just like i don’t know let’s call it 30 or 40 of just random [ ] mistakes that i would have been making plus then there’s the strategy like okay she gave me this i’ll share an exam specific example so like she told me this thing she goes all right i i snapped a picture of a meal i ate she goes like whoa big meal and i’m like yeah yeah you know whatever she’s got you know her job is to kind of judge my meals right okay fair and she’s like do me a favor before you eat i want you to just on a scale of one to five just take take note just like at the beginning here i’m not gonna change anything in your diet but just observe how hungry were you when you started the meal like if one is absolutely starving and five is absolutely stuffed like were you starving when you when you decided to eat or were you like a two or three on the hunger scale and then when you were done were you like um so stuffed i need a nap or are you like you know okay i’m full i’m done and she’s like don’t change anything just like give yourself a number before and after after every meal so i started doing it and she’s like i was like so what do i want like you know start at a two and end at a four she’s like no you kind of want to start at a three and end at a three like you know you basically want to be like okay it’s been about three hours i think i’ll like i’ll eat now i think i could eat i don’t have to eat but i could i could definitely eat right now because you’re creating like patterns and being consistent and when i’m done eating it’s like i don’t stop eating when i can’t physically eat anymore i stop eating because like cool like i’ve had enough of my meal and i can move on i know that there’s gonna be more food in a couple hours i don’t need to like you know stuff myself to the brim here and so literally these like very small like nuances so i’d notice oh man i really do tend to eat bad when i get to a one because then i’m just like i’m redlining i gotta i just like my decision making is very poor there so i’m like normally if i like eat at a two and i finish at a three i’m like very proud of like those all those meals so little things like that or you know certain like like hey give me i was like yo give me a grocery list i’m going to whole foods just give me a grocery list and i’m just going to buy only that [ ] so i only have that to eat at home like you know let’s make this simple and so she gave me like an exact grocery list i went and bought all that stuff i was like oh this is great so it’s an amazing service yeah my my coach was like anytime you want a snack because i would like snack a lot she was like get a baked potato put it a paper towel over it and rinse the bake get it wet and just put it in the microwave for five minutes and just eat that and i started eating that i’m like oh this is delicious this tastes wonderful and it’s only 150 calories so like i was like what the [ ] is a sweet potato i didn’t know what a sweet potato was you know what i mean it’s like that’s what you call your girlfriend when you’re in high school it’s like dave chappelle when they do switching spouses when the black guy goes with the white family and he goes what the [ ] is a parsnip like he doesn’t know what a parsnip is it’s like i don’t know what a [ ] sweet potato is [Laughter] who’s renee zell wisher that’s what he says so anyway it’s been a good service i like my body tour it’s good me too me too this is not an ad we’re not paid to do it i genuinely like the product and it’s helping me also it’s like 700 a month and i don’t want to spend that anymore but i said the only way i’m quitting is when i’m here it’s like 200 250. i do the thing where they call you every single day okay so they call me they call me every morning and i can’t cheat because my wife and fa and like family knows that i’m doing it and they’re like oh you’re going to tell heather that you just ate that i’m like well that was the biggest thing i had to make a decision am i is this 100 honesty or is this 90 honesty or 60 honesty like you know there are levels to this whole honesty thing and so i was like all right i decided if i’m gonna spend this money i gotta do 100 honesty i don’t know this person i’ve never met this person like she’s gonna be my little confidant of every single thing i eat in the exact thing like yeah i i did just put ranch on my potato like yeah that that happened you know i can’t explain it i just did it and so i’m like i gotta take the actual photo of the actual thing every single time no matter what and i think that also the commitment to actually doing it right is what actually makes you get a good result from things um do you want me to keep going you want to do another one let me do another one yeah let’s go all right have you heard of aviator nation no all right so this is this week’s billy of the week so basically um have you heard of um tom shoes remember tom shoes like give one of course buy one give one type of thing you know like the hipster shoes well anyway the guy who started it his name was blake by the way you go to africa are we is everybody just running around to tell them shoes they better be at this point yeah at this point yeah 20 years time that’s for sure time shoes better be like the official shoe of like south africa they gotta everyone should have a pair of time shoes um so her name is uh paige how do you say their last name mikowski uh blake and so anyway um so her this woman paige and her brother is blake the guy started tom’s they got kind of popular and they got seed money because they were on like this thing called uh you probably knew all about this the amazing raise um and so they like did that and got a little bit of seed money whatever so he starts toms the same day she starts a different company called aviator nation now you are not in the target demographic of aviator nation it’s mostly women particularly like young like high school and i think middle school girls like it’s like a status symbol a little bit but basically she uh uh taught herself how to sew just like on youtube and she started going to like fairs like venice beach uh flea markets and things like that and she would sew like these interesting stripes on like old vintage sweatshirts like you know nothing like breathtaking but kind of cool and like she would be making like five or 10k a day every once in a while when she would go and it was kind of working and she bootstrapped this business to the point of 16 years later um she owns 100 of the company in 2020 it did 70 million in revenue 2021 110 million in revenue 2022 it’s going to double again so it’s going to be north of 200 in revenue and last year she paid herself a 50 million dollar dividend check and she’s buying a lot of she’s yeah she’s buying a lot of real estate with it and in this uh article i read forbes was like we estimated that she’s worth around 350 million dollars but she said the number is at least double that and she recently acquired her ninth property a 15 million dollar lakeside house in austin and she has other homes in malibu venice beach marina del rey and ask in a aspen ski chalet and uh she says that if if she didn’t subscribe to my first million none of this would have happened that is [ ] crazy dude yeah she said she reads the milk road every day yeah she subscribes and shares with friends like unbelievable yeah what a sweetheart and uh have you have you ever heard of this business i’ve never heard about this until forbes did an article on it no and this i’m i don’t know why but i’m almost mad i don’t even know what i’m mad at but i’m just like this because you go to the website you go to the website and this literally could be like someone’s school project this could be like an aliexpress demo site this could be and i don’t i don’t mean that to to kind of [ ] on it but i’m like what am i looking at this is basically a shirt with four stripes on it it’s like uh you know like a sweater with a lightning bolt it’s like a dude wearing black shorts with a yellow stripe on the side the short oh wow the shorts are 168 dollars yeah so and i forgot to add that that’s like the shtick which is it’s uh like sweatpants are 160 so like the items of clothing are luxury brand yeah a little bit short of luxury but like basically my friend joe told me that his uh kids wear it or they always like are wanting it because they’ll see girls in school wearing it and it’s like 150 dollars for a pair of sweatpants and so this is a mystery box for me like how do you do this how do you make something just like arbitrarily cool and in demand when it seems like there are a trillion you know like alternatives to this and like i kind of get it when it’s like established brands it’s like oh yeah well you know louis vuitton or whatever they have this like history of like being seen as valuable so therefore people will continue saying it valuable this is just like some woman at her dining table was like no you know what three stripes on the hoodie eight hundred dollars this plan will work and like somehow it did i don’t under explain this so like makes my head hurt listen in that book what’s peter thiel’s book zero to one he talks about like he’s like there’s like basically like these i don’t remember the words he used but he said like there’s like a moat or like the truth uh like you have to know something that no one else knows and basically you have to like figure out some a secret some type of like technology that others haven’t figured out but he goes and peter thiel is like this kind of like autistic-y like genius and he’s like the fifth one is branding which i don’t know anything about that i don’t know about cool but i know that that’s like important that’s kind of like what he says in the book he’s like branding is like a moat but like you know i don’t know anything about moats i i just do technology and i think that i’ve been chatting with a remember how we had sophia omarosa on the on the on the pod she’s the woman who started nasty gal she’s got all these other new projects going on and like a woman like her just everything she does to me is just like cool it just looks well when i met when we when we met her i was like oh yeah like whatever you are selling i’m buying like uh dig your vibe you seem awesome like you’re wearing like six rings right now i don’t even own one i feel like i should own six now like i don’t know what’s happening but like i am drawn to your lifestyle your charisma or whatever and i think that’s like the you know whatever like you know that works for nasty gal i think it works for like goop and [ ] like that where it’s like there’s just something about certain taste makers and trendsetters where you’re like exactly all right i just want to like i just want to drink whatever you’re drinking well if you google this woman paige um she kind of has that vibe she’s like the jessica simpson version of nasty gal like maybe a little bit like maybe like a little bit less like edgy but like still cool uh right you know like uh like just a little bit more like uh she always looks like she just got back from coachella yeah oh you just got back yeah like she’s not gonna do coke with you but like she’ll have like really good peach iced tea but it’s still like cool and like you always like you’re like oh what the hell what the [ ] is this hibiscus stuff like that type of the vibe and uh anyway i like her i love this woman paige i have been reading all about her this company is really really cool and you’re in the you’re in the ecomm space a bunch of our friends are in the ecom space and it’s really hard right now and i’ve read about this woman and i was like oh well she sure makes it look kind of easy it’s kind of interesting exactly i think that’s why i have such a big reaction to it because i’m an ecommerce i’m just like how how the oh how do you do this you know you ramped up to 200 million in sales with like the most competitive common category like shirts oh no yeah okay what makes your shirts good they’re just cool you know i’m like yeah yeah but that doesn’t count for 100 million and it’s like actually it can if you really are cool enough and you build that grassroots thing what i want to learn and i don’t know if there’s a way to even like figure out this backstory without doing a bunch of work but like the there is something to like the foundation of cool right so like um how do you build a frame a foundation or like a ladder that will that will like you know started it sounds like she went to festivals and she’s in the for the first store was in haiti ashbury and in san francisco and it’s like with the right group of people you start getting going and then it kind of like spreads from there and i’ve never understood that when it comes to fashion i never understood but her brother has that too so if you google blake myoski and you see like his house like he’s got like a vintage uh like a vintage like toyota land cruiser truck with like a golden retriever and like a cool like pennington pendleton whatever it’s called blanket like laying over the hood and like skis on top of the truck in front of their malibu like even though it’s like you know they’re just wealthy so it’s maybe it’s easy like have all that cool [ ] there is like a sense of style uh that he’s just always had i i think part of the cool thing is you just you’re just good looking to be honest i think that’s definitely like get to the root of it right i mean like brad pitt could wear anything and then i could wear the same clothing it’s just like he just looks better he’s just better looking i mean of course like he’s cooler but there is a few other things i think that that are a little bit more uh learnable and and replicable when it comes to that but these people definitely have it it reminds me uh so yesterday i was talking to my mom and my mom’s in town or my mom was like visiting my house and uh i started doing this thing i did a podcast with my mom where i was like i really want to hear my mom’s story like uh because we all talk to our moms but we don’t like really talk it’s like surface level stuff or it’s all about the kid and you know moms are great because they’re like you know they’re all about you but like how often do you really sit down and ask them questions about like them and they’re how they grew up and what made them them so i recorded this podcast with my mom because you know parents are getting older and i just always wanted to have it it was amazing and one of the things she had told me i don’t know if i shared the story on the podcast before but she had told me like her trip to america like how she got here and like um and it wasn’t hardship like um it wasn’t hardship like oh my god we we were smuggled in and boats and like we had to like you know walk through the rio grande with just our nose above the water like it wasn’t hard like that it was hard in the way that’s like very relatable in that just unknown you just don’t know what you don’t know and then you’re in a situation and there’s nobody to help you and so she talked about like she got on the plane and like uh she saw the seat belt they’re like fashion seatbelt ma’am and she’s like you know like a plane seat belt is not like any other seat belt you’ve ever seen and i don’t know how she was like and she’s just like clacking it together over and over again and she just like goes in and like she was so happy like oh my god like thing number one done like i could do this and then she was like all right i’m flying to america like i don’t want to miss my stop because she’d only ever been on a train so she’s like wide awake for like 16 hours of a flight being like when are they gonna announce like the america stop and i need to get off this this plane and like she didn’t know that a plane just like goes to one place and that’s it and there was like so many things like when she got to the place that she got to jfk or something like that she needed to transfer to pittsburgh she just didn’t know she was like i think i’m in america like i didn’t really know beyond that like i have to get to pittsburgh what is a pittsburgh and she’s like um she was like 20 at the time and she put like her 20 is like today’s like seven-year-old like because she had never been to a restaurant she couldn’t speak english she um like she told me once she’s like yeah right before i went to america she told me that yesterday she goes i went as like our school thing we went to a restaurant and i’d never eaten outside of my house and so i was like oh okay and she’s like there was like a fork and knife on the table and i didn’t know like i knew what they were but i didn’t know how you hold them and she’s like i’m looking around and everybody’s doing it so fast and i’m like okay what what are they doing with their like how do they pick this up like this and she’s like i basically didn’t eat i paid for the most expensive meal of my life and i didn’t know how to get the food into my mouth i was so embarrassed to use my hands i just didn’t do it and so i was hearing these stories and i was like we all have these moments where like the world seems too mysterious for us like this is like i don’t know what this this black box is like completely foreign to me and i don’t know how to operate it and like her trip to america had like five of these like she was talking about like when she finally got off the plane and the uh american guy had met her and it was like okay you clearly look like completely panicked he was like do you know like where you’re going like do you have a family to come pick you up and she’s no like why did you have somebody’s phone number would she go to college or something uh she was even younger she was actually she was 17 she was she started high school three days later in america when she came and so she she came because if you come right before your 18th birthday you’re not an adult yet so you have to do way less paperwork so her dad like put her on a plane at 17 was like go you’re like you’re about to turn 18 in three days like you need to get over there and so her brother was here but uh you know like she didn’t know how to get to his house she didn’t know like all the steps it takes to get there so this guy was like do you have her phone number his phone number and she was like yeah yeah look i have a phone number and he’s like okay let’s go to this pay phone and he’s like and she was like i don’t know what this is like i don’t know what this device is and i don’t have money and i don’t know how to do this so he pay he puts quarters in and he calls and then she’s like she talks to her brother and brother’s like whoa you’re here like i didn’t even know you’re coming like okay stay exactly where you are don’t move i will go to the airport and i’ll find you at the at the phone booth do not move like one step and she’s like okay and she’s like the guy who had helped me like set up the phone call he had to go catch his next flight or he was she speak english she could like read english but she couldn’t speak it she’d never practice speaking so she like you know was here and she’s like oh [ ] and so she was like she was like i’ll never forget she’s like i was trying to like i was done with the phone call but i didn’t understand how to hang up the phone i couldn’t like i couldn’t figure out how to get the pay phone back like what was the original starting point i didn’t remember and she’s like i remember i just like left it hanging like the cord hanging the phone was swinging i like walked away and i was so scared like the police are gonna get me for what i just did and she’s like everything was so new like you know on the way home we stopped at a 7-11 and i this is a palace like look at how much stuff is here look how bright these lights are i’ve never seen lights so bright in my life and like you know all every little thing was so amazing and so i say this for two reasons one is if you haven’t done like the kind of like podcast with your mom go do it it’s amazing even if you don’t have a podcast you don’t need to publish it well just like few people are gonna have as good of a story as that i don’t know like i feel like everybody’s got a story when you start to dig in and then for my mom it was almost like she didn’t think about this stuff like it was only like halfway through when i got to like the interesting bit because it was all like just so buried in her head you know she what does she remember from 40 years ago but then she did remember once i got like on the right trail uh but the other thing is like when i hear the story about this woman who you know just put stripes on a t-shirt and like grows it like crazy and i’m saying that kind of like to me it looks so simple but obviously there’s more to it i just don’t know what the more to it is and i’m sure there’s people who listen to this podcast and they hear these things i hear us talk about many things and they’re like i feel like you guys say it like it’s so obvious but it’s like completely not obvious to me it’s like where do how do i hang up the pay phone like how do i connect the the seat belt um like i don’t know that’s okay like there is that everybody’s got that black box and then like later you look back and you laugh and you’re like yeah so can’t believe it you you and i you’re i i don’t you’re not an immigrant but but you and most all of my friends and i think you as well all of our friends are either immigrants or kids of immigrants um i i feel like i’m like the only like not not one of those that that i’m i’m close with my my wife is that my family’s that you’re that and um what you what you notice talking to these people and a lot of you and i are friends with a lot of immigrant entrepreneurs or children of immigrants and their entrepreneurs and you you like i often wonder i’m like how are these people succeeding when there’s it’s they’re coming from a place where things are much harder you know like i i i didn’t learn how to i didn’t have to learn how to you know use a pay phone i just knew and you hear the story about your mom and you’re like well that’s why they succeed so well because well she had to learn how to use a fork like that’s like i imagine like pretty humiliating and you’re frightened you’re frightened you get on a plane to like you know it sounds like to her it’d be as as if you sent me to uh the moon you know what i mean you’re like what the hell like i don’t know i don’t know anything and it’s like well okay i like landed it i found my brother somehow like what’s the worst that can happen they’re going to send me back to this play i mean like you know it can’t be that bad uh failing failing at least and so when you talk about people who are like well i don’t know what to do it’s like yeah but like it’s kind of straightforward you just can’t really be afraid to do it because like the worst that’s going to happen is not that bad like you know what i mean if this woman from india can come knowing nothing and she ends with like this big family and she’s your parents are pretty successful like it can work out if you just kind of take a little bit of risk it’s pretty inspiring our software is the worst have you heard of hubspot see most crms are a cobble together mess but hubspot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous i think i love our new crm our software is the best hubspot grow better yeah i think that’s where two common immigrant traits come from number one like a willingness to grind it out in a way that’s like nothing is beneath me you know like okay like she was like you know two weeks later i had a job as a waitress like the person who had never been to a restaurant now was hired as a waitress in america and couldn’t speak english and she’s like my brother was like how the hell did you get a job and she’s like i don’t know you said we needed a job and so i just kept going to different places every like hour i just went to a different place to interview this one liked me and they just gave me the job and like okay i have to go at like four in the morning before school and like i’m gonna you know help clean the stuff and then i’m gonna go at night and like that’s what i’ll do and so that you get this like grit side but then you also get the like kind of like why are immigrants so cheap it’s because like they’ve operated with no safety net before and so now when they have some resources they’re like don’t squander them we remember what it was like to have no resources with no back no net to catch you if you fall and so like yeah don’t like spend too much even once like a lot of immigrant parents end up in america like they end up getting rich but they still live very cheaply and i think it’s because like if you’ve lived it’s like you know somebody who’s like i don’t know they like grew up in the woods and it’s like oh why do you sleep on the floor still it’s like i just do okay like don’t ask me too many questions it’s like i know i have a bed now but like i don’t need i don’t need the bed i don’t i don’t want to use that right now because i feel like you know anything could happen right now and so well a lot of my same fear and a lot of my friends so my mother-in-law’s from haiti and i would talk to her so she did i tell you how she started this pillow business i don’t know how big it is exactly but i imagine mid six figures and um she took she asked me to to take drive me two hours to the airport and i was like why she’s like i want to ask you how shopify works i think i want to create an online store where i sell these pillows and i’m like all right whatever i’ll explain to you how to do it but i like people ask me this all the time they never follow up and they never do anything and so she calls me six weeks later she’s like alright i got my first sale now what it’s like oh my god and i was talking to her and the way that they would describe it you know my in-law my in-laws as well as my other other immigrant friends it’s kind of like what’s interesting is when you take like these immigrants and you put them in america where there’s like a pretty strict rules and laws like and like mostly the government can’t take things from you and like your stuff is mostly protected it’s like well this is easy this is not easy mode like like we all know we all know the rules and we know that people are mostly all gonna follow the rules like this is easy this is just a board game like you just gotta play it and uh and so i’m always inspired hanging out with those types of people yeah for sure me too uh you said something just now which is like i think is an important uh little thing which was i tell people the stuff all the time and like very few take action like most people just don’t do anything with this i’ve been kind of i’ve been admiring there’s been a bunch of people who have built cool [ ] for us that like i just want to call out is kind of awesome and i don’t know where it leads and i like that they did it knowing not where it leads but something good is going to happen i’ll give you give you a couple examples somebody created this thing i don’t know if you saw it they put it on product hunt it’s like the mfm ideas system i i wish i knew the link off top of my head but if you go to production you search my first million um basically he went and indexed like i don’t know 30 or 40 percent of all of the different ideas we’ve said on this podcast where we’re like oh mailchimp but for inside your company because you need to write internal newsletters blah blah blah and so they’ll take that idea he time stamped it and so you can go to the website and it will be you’ll just be like give me an idea and it’ll give you an idea and then it says listen to it and you click it and it opens up in spotify or whatever some player like exactly where we talked about that idea and i was like wow this is so awesome for us but also for anybody who’s a fan of the podcast and immediately i was like drawn to this person and and it’s such a it’s such a hack to stand out just by like doing a useful thing and there’s so much energy that gets spent like reading books listening to podcasts like ask asking people for advice you know and it’s like dude you know instead spend actually like a one-third of the time and actually like build something or make something that’s like kind of interesting uh that will get you so much further there’s another guy who built this thing called writelikeshawn.com have you seen this that was really good it was great this guy created this thing he trained gpt3 like like the ai model or whatever to on a bunch of my twitter threads and he goes oh yeah i trained this ai to write like you so watch you can just type in any topic and it’ll spit out a twitter thread and i was like okay yeah i did it it was awesome it was great it’s actually awesome this guy someone put it in there um let me let me find it he put in i’m gonna pull this up pretty amazing how the uh the the language like it is it is like you i i put something in there and like the cadence sounded exactly like you so uh okay so this person uh where’s the one somebody wrote how to pick up girls or whatever or somebody wrote how to be happy and then it goes you don’t find happiness you create it most people go through life searching for happiness they think that when they find the right job right relationship right house they’ll finally be happy but the truth is happiness comes from within here’s how you create it yourself number one do something that makes you happy every day it doesn’t have to be big it can be small like this is a [ ] computer that’s writing a very realistic you know looking thing uh here’s another one um why we don’t do public math right somebody’s a fan of the podcast he goes we don’t do public math think about it when’s the last time you did math in public i mean really did math addition subtraction multiplication not mental math but using your fingers a calculator or a piece of paper when’s the last time you saw someone do math in public it’s almost like we’re ashamed of it we don’t want people to see a struggle at math we think they’ll think we’re stupid but the truth is math is hard and it’s normal to struggle with it so let’s start doing public math like it like changes our whole perspective by the end let’s try practice public math period together how does how did how did how can i make one of those because i would like to do that for my stuff and just still write emails for me so what do you do you just like tell gpthree to read all of your tweets and it gets to you yeah we should just get this guy so this guy adil pickle is his name is his like twitter handle i told him because i i put it in my newsletter i was like check this out this is awesome and it like crashed his site and he ran up a thousand dollar bill before it crashed the site he’s like ah i know my side project i was like dude i’ll like i’ll pay your bill just let me own the thing and i’ll pay your bill like it’s my it’s right like sean i’ll buy it off you and then you don’t have to worry about this stuff um and so because i i think it’d be cool to like like i love uh john steinbeck um i’ve been reading it you know you you don’t even know who that is famous american author whatever a classic american author like you know like the he’s like from the crew that wrote like uh catcher in the ride that type of crap i would love to like write my marketing emails like those guys and i think it’d be cool if i could if i could figure out how to like teach gpd3 what um you want to go to a different cry into the background i don’t know if you could hear it that’s all right what topics you want to go to um well there is a couple others on this like gpt3 thing yeah like um so basically like this the ai has gotten really really good at really specific things like i don’t know have you played with dolly that’s that yeah that is the craziest [ ] on earth that is way crazier than gbt three it’s the picture version of this you just type in any concept it’s like um sampar surfing while smoking a cigarette and it’ll generate like 12 pictures like ai illustrates sampar on a surfboard smoking a cigarette it’ll give you a bunch of variations dude i told it to do wild [ ] i said do real-life grown-up cartman and bart simpson and it made a real life like a it looked like a photo a photograph of what a grown-up cartman from south park a cartoon looked like it was crazy it is so impressive this is like the demo version it’s not even the real version i’m going to start doing a thing um there’s this company i want to invest in that does this with voices and so uh basically he sent me a clip of of gary vee reading the milk road so it was like you know it goes good morning you know is like the garyvee voice it read the thing and it sounds exactly like garyvee and then he’s like here’s jordan peterson doing it here’s joe rogan doing it here’s garyvee doing it and he’s like if you give me like 16 hours of like your podcast audio data like i’ll just i can make your voice like a synthetic voice so then you could like you could just type something and um it’ll do it’ll record the audio for you the way you talk and i was like what in the world is going on so this stuff is so amazing to me it’s really captured by fascination and it’s just the beginning like this is gonna get so much better and has all kinds of crazy implications like hey you’re not gonna know what’s real and what’s fake like cause fake and real are gonna be like indistinguishable like like a deep fake video or like a photoshopped photo but for everything for voices for videos for drawings for whatever uh twitter threads like it’s not unreasonable that like most of the content you read on the internet is just gonna be written by computers dude like you’re gonna go on twitter it’s just gonna be auto-generated content from brands and and and people that are you know just plugging it into the ai and ai’s spitting out good content for us all to consume like we may not have hollywood at some point it’ll just be like computers making movies and the rest of us just like you know wally what’s that movie where they’re like fat people sitting in wheelchairs and just like sucking down slurpees and watching stuff it’ll just be that because it’s like oh we don’t need to do the work to make stuff anymore so the computers make awesome movies we just watch them dude let me let me tell you a quick story as we kind of wrap up real quick about you know how like you know it’s not for a little while it’s been not cool to live in a city lately and it’s been cool to live in like uh less popular places like in portland austin that type of thing last night i went to a wedding i went it was my wife’s buddy’s wedding so they weren’t like you know my friend they weren’t like what i thought were like you know our startup eating early friends and i sat at this table and listened to my table i didn’t know who any people were they were we just started chit chatting the the person next to me started a business that had raised uh 30 million dollars at a star and these all these people are about 28 years old had raised like 30 million dollars the person next to them had a company that in two years hired 300 people the person next to them had a startup that they sold for 140 million dollars the person next to them had a vc fund that had a billion dollars raised and they this person graduated college in 09 so however old you are 33 with that and then the person next to them was um a partner at one of the biggest management consulting firms and so it’s like mostly like and then there’s some poor like english teacher in the middle who’s just like what am i what is this come on come on do it here why i’m the one doing real work out here so no one was douchey at all so the reason why i even knew that was because they like had seen sarah post about me and they’re like oh you do the podcast about startups i was like oh yeah okay so you must be in startups too yeah i work at this company oh what do you do there oh i actually started it so like they’re trying to they’re being cool about it so it it it was pretty inspiring to be around these people i’m used to like you know sometimes being like a big shot sometimes amongst my my like non-entrepreneurial friend group and i go around these people and i’m like oh my god like this is like incredibly motivating i actually think that there’s a world where it’s a little unhealthy because uh you’re like you know like this money [ ] doesn’t actually matter that much but it’s so it’s kind of [ ] that i’m like comparing myself to others but it’s incredibly incredibly motivating and that’s something that i miss about san francisco uh and we had that for a little while yeah that is that was the best part about san francisco by far like people like how san francisco it’s like oh well the city is basically gotham city uh you know it’s cold it’s not actually like warm california weather uh you know it’s super expensive it’s you know all these things the upside is like you know if you want to hang out with some of the most ambitious interesting people who like look at the world a little differently and are kind of crazy enough to go pursue it you’re just going to keep bumping into them like everywhere you go regardless what you’re doing and sure enough your brain will start to change to be more like them dude what’s funny is i feel like our friends weren’t even ambitious you know like jack smith is not an ambitious person he just like works on interesting things and just so happens that they become huge money making operations or like we have a few friends that are ambitious but we have a bunch of friends it’s just like i don’t think jack i think is more of an outlier jackie is more like just like curious and mischievous more than he is ambitious but i don’t think most people are like jack i think jack’s a bit of an outlier i don’t consider myself to be ambitious do you consider yourself to be ambitious you you are ambitious yes you are i don’t consider a lot of our friends i’m just like we just like doing interesting things and it just so happens that the output is yeah but yours is like jax is like i like doing interesting things as in like he’ll build a ergonomic chair in his garage to like see what that’s like your version is like i like just doing interesting things that are highly profitable and like there’s a caveat there’s like an important caveat to your like you’re not like just reading novels from like you know uh 18th century you’re like okay how do i you know spin up this thing that’s gonna get to six figures in revenue very quickly right like that’s that’s your version of what’s interesting what’s interesting to you is kind of the the hook right so like what’s interesting to people like okay ferkan i would say is very ambitious he’s not very money-minded right ambition is not money it’s like but he’s like super interested in new tech and so you know our office would have like oh he you know here’s why why doesn’t the tv remote work oh sorry i changed the t i like took the chip out of the tv i put a raspberry pi in it’s like why can’t i use this beer tap oh because i put a [ ] like drone that floats above it and like you know like what is this where’s my computer it’s like oh i needed a place to put my 3d printer and like eight out of ten of those turned out to be just like you know money sucks like there’s there was no commercial value in the raspberry pi or the mini drones or the 3d printing or any of that stuff it was just like the fifth one where he’s like yeah i’m playing around with this like crypto thing you know this thing how ethereum just came out and it’s like just happened to be that that one was like one that turned out to be extremely profitable and like you know changed the world in a bigger way but you know the interest was in let’s say for him tech or like our buddy xavier is just like dude how do i provide electricity to people in africa who don’t have it right that’s ambition in a different way right that was inspiring right like i was like holy [ ] you’re the biggest solar provider in africa but i guess what i mean is like in in new york i noticed that the ambition is like uh let me crawl up this ladder and climb to the top of the ladder because i want to be number one and i’m gonna kick other people off the ladder and make sure like stomp on their face as i’m going up so they can’t get as high as as i am right whereas it seems that maybe i’m just being like uh just i just think our [ ] don’t stink which is it’s more like let’s create new ladders it’s like here’s the test of new york it’s like do you know which finger can take the least amount of pressure before it gives up its grip it’s like yeah step on the ring finger they’re done whereas in san francisco it’s a little bit different right san francisco the virtue signaling is different like what you get rewarded for is different you get rewarded for uh i’m solving some big problem at scale billion users billion dollar prize that’s what you’re going for and it’s okay like your high status if you’re broke but going for a big big prize whereas in new york you don’t get high status for broke like it’s like san francisco it’s like the guy with the biggest ratio of wealth to poor looking is like the winner you know like you you have to be like the most raggedy looking dude with the most amount of money yeah yeah make the most money and then give up all your possessions and live on the street like that is the like peak right that’s like jack go look at jack dorsey it’s like okay you build two multi-billion dollar companies but then you grow a homeless man beard and you like pretend you don’t care about it you give all your money away and you wear a tie-dye t-shirt and like you know you carry around a notebook and like that’s you know while you walk barefoot it’s like that that’s the highest status like person you can be in silicon valley what did you think of the peter lovells podcast i thought it was dope like i think he’s great uh i like him like you know um i always liked his content but i like him i didn’t know him um and i like the way he thinks i like the way he acts i thought he was i thought he was pretty honest like he didn’t come on here and try to perform and he got the vibe he got the the you know i think he’s a hit he’s a hit i like him there’s a handful of people who we were friends with and who we’ve talked to publicly who i think i would put in the category of like oh they’ve kind of figured it out and of course that they’re flawed and they make mistakes and they’re not always happy and whatever that just like normal humans but like in general they’ve kind of got it figured out i would say darmesh is in that category where it’s like oh man you’ve like you have a lot of the boxes checked up like you seem happy you seem like you got a good family your career is good jack smith our good buddy is another one of those people uh he started a company that he sold for 800 million dollars but like he’s not that like he doesn’t really care about that and he’ll never tell you about it unless you ask about it but he’s happy and healthy and then this guy levels peter levels i would put him in the same category where it’s like you kind of like seem like you know what you want and you stick with it and you have principles and you’re you’re achieving exactly your ideal life right and that’s by the way you know the you know the tell that i figured out like the what’s the quickest way for me to pick up on is that person like those people like our some of our favorite people are like that i put suli in that category i put ferkan in that category i put a bunch of ramones in that category it’s what percent of your like kind of when you talk about yourself or what you’re doing what percent there’s two tests one is what percent of a conversation do you talk about yourself versus your asked questions you’re interested or curious about other things other people other things then the second is when you talk about yourself what percent is talking about the past stuff you’ve done versus stuff you’re interested in doing or the future and it sounds very simple but i’ll like if you go to their bios very few of them even have their last company in their bio whereas if you go to my bio it’s like sold bebo right like number one the first thing i write in there is like sold the thing you know like i’ve done something cool please ask me about it i love to tell you about my wins and you’re fairly you’re you’re fairly close to being in that category of like i feel like you know what you want and even if you don’t get what you want you’re still mostly happy yeah and the the thing that’s helped me is like uh i’m getting away from doing that i’m getting away from basically trying to seek validation in some way and then the second like that that’s that’s why we talk about our past right to like kind of like give ourselves some status or to get some validation from others is like you know here’s my background here’s what i’ve done therefore please give me some respect and and whatever else and once i picked up that these other guys do that very differently i started to shed that it’s like somebody will bring something up in a conversation i i think of an anecdote where i can tell them a really cool story of how i’ve done that and i’m just like well that doesn’t actually add to the conversation they’re already convinced why do i need to do that i don’t need to i don’t need to perform here it’s fine and so i like let that go and that thought never used to be let go it always used to be something i would immediately jump in at any opportunity to kind of like you know hey can you validate my parking here here’s my ticket stub can you please punch a hole in it and like that’s how i felt like i was doing stuff and then i noticed these guys don’t do that and i talked i remember asking silly i go i feel like you never i kind of have to brag for you when we meet people because like dude they don’t even know who you are they don’t know you’re a hit like how much of a hitter you are and you want to look and sean wants to look cooler that he’s associated with julian why did i bring this guy to this meeting yeah because this guy’s [ ] awesome and like hold on you didn’t do it you didn’t brag let me brag yeah and um and i was like i was like why do you do that i was like as i also feel like you don’t even talk about or think about like all the stuff you’ve done in the past and like he was like he’s like yeah i mean i don’t i don’t know i don’t really do i don’t really feel the need to he’s like you know i heard kobe bryant give a talk once and he’s like it was after kobe retired and he was talking about like the new [ ] he was into he’s like cause i don’t know if you know kobe started like making little mini movies and like he like got really into storytelling and movies and like that was like what he wanted to do right great stories movies and stuff yeah and so he was like creating he created like a production and kobe had said something that was like i need my next 20 years to make my last 20 years like a footnote like the next 20 years need to be the best thing i’ve ever done and this is coming from one of the greatest hall of fame basketball players whereas if you see what most players do when they retire they go put on a suit they put on 30 pounds and then they go sit at an espn desk and they talk about how the players these days don’t get it back in my day we used to be so great and like they and they never like move on to the next great adventure and they don’t they think it’s it’s implicit that the best work of their life was behind them and that’s why they gained the weight that’s why they aren’t as happy that’s why they’re nostalgic for the good old days whereas somebody who looks at it like oh this next chapter is my best chapter and that’s a different that person’s gonna like go through life a little differently and so he told me he’s like when i heard that i thought the same thing like oh yeah great my next company it needs to make my last company be this like little afterthought like we’ll put it in the appendix of like stuff i’m done and if i think about it that way then i won’t put so much emphasis on it i won’t use it as my crutch as like a way to get kind of respect or attention or anything like that i’m gonna only make my new thing the way i do it and um and i really respected that i was like that’s great have you heard the song uh damn it feels good to be a gangster of course basically uh in one of the lines he says real gangsters don’t flex nuts because they know they got him that’s that’s what we’re talking about here you don’t flex nuts because you know you got them yeah exactly exactly i think that’s the episode